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  • SunXia
    SunXia closed this thread because:
    14:28, March 21, 2019

    The main conflict between Quincy and Shinigami is that the former's destruction of hollows upsets the balance of souls. However, what if there was a way to prevent the hollows they defeat from being completely destroyed? In the "Turn Back the Pendulum" arc Aizen's attempts to hollowify ordinary souls resulted in them disintegrating as they couldn't retain human form. When Urahara heard about these strange deaths we see him briefly talking about a prototype for a new gigai. His theory was that if souls on the verge of destruction were placed into a human mold it could reform them. Now, if this special gigai were perfected and used on a massive scale then when Quincies eliminated hollows their human souls wouldn't be destroyed and could be sent to the Soul Society by Shinigami like normal. This could not only eliminate the conflict but greatly increase hollow elimination rates while maintaining the balance of souls. Do you think this is a good idea?

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    • How exactly would it be implemented? Were the Quincy gonna accepted their help and offered themselves for continued experimentations? If we go by timeline, and if i'm not mistaking, the Quincy genocide happened before that technology was created.

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    • The Quincy genocide did occur before the "Turn Back the Pendulum Arc," but I'm talking about the current storyline after the finale. While Yhwach used his Auschwalen to take the Vollstanding of the Sternritters who remained below in the Seireitei, nothing was said about the other miscellaneous Quincy. Neither the epilogue or the novels recently released mention what happened to the Quincy who survived. If they escaped and eventually rebuild themselves, then the conflict between them and the Shinigami will eventually resume. So, the gigai technology I am thinking of could help prevent this. If there are more Quincy survivors, they wouldn't need to submit themselves to experimentation as Mayuri has already experimented on (by his count) over 2600 of them (before he met Uryu he was confident he knew everything about them).By combining Mayuri's research with Kisuke's gigai technology a way to restore souls destroyed by the Quincy technique should be possible.

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    • Fair warning, this discussion could be randomly closed by admins for being too speculative but there are flaws with your premise. One, to beat a hollow the Quincy has to fatally wound it and it would already be too late to save the soul with that gigai. Two, don't assume that the problem is simply the soul's destruction, if that were the case hollows or fullbringers killing hollows would have caused problems as well. It is more likely that since all Quincy have a bit of Yhwach in them the souls of hollows may just disappear and go straight to Yhwach, removing them from the flow entirely (this idea of merely Yhwach's soul fragments in his servants when they kill being needed to reap souls for him came from a conversation early on between Uryuu and Haschwalt).

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    • @DarkMuse616 Theory is more creditable, and connects with Yhwach's soul sharing ability.

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    • Even if you had to fatally wound it would not be too late too save the soul. Urahara's plan was to use his Gigai model to save souls on the verge of disintegration (implying they were already fatally damaged). So, if his theory were correct then it should not be impossible. As for hollows killing other hollows, that probably does cause problems as well. In the series it is shown that if a hollow devours a human and/or another hollow then they will become apart of them. This would logically be another reason the Shinigami hunt hollows as not only does their existence threaten the balance, but their devouring of other souls prevents those souls from moving on as well. As for the Fullbringers, it was never stated in the series if their powers destroy souls. In fact, in chapter 480 Mayuri says the Quincies are the only ones capable of removing hollows from existence itself. As for Yhwach's soul distribution power, Haschwalth said that Yhwach needed to impart a piece of his soul on the souls that will come back to him. This does apply to those destroyed by said souls.

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    • Aita666 wrote:As for Yhwach's soul distribution power, Haschwalth said that Yhwach needed to impart a piece of his soul on the souls that will come back to him. This does apply to those destroyed by said souls.

      [1], [2]

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    • As the first page says, Yhwach was only able to obtain the souls of the opponents his Quincy fought because he was able to spread parts of his soul around the Seireitei during the first battle. To do so, he had to be physically present. However, Yhwach had been sealed away for a thousand years before the final arc, and so could not have been physically present for whenever Quincy fought Hollows in that time period. Even if he was not sealed, the number of Quincy during this time was too numerous for him to be there every time one fought a hollow.

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      • Yhwach = First Quincy and ALL Quincy's have Yhwach's blood in them = soul.

      Masaki and Katagiri didn't drink his blood.

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    • True, but that still doesn't back up DarkMuse616's claim. They claimed that it was possible that the hollows destroyed by Quincy go to Yhwach rather than be erased from existence. While Quincy have Yhwach's blood in them, the hollows they fight do not and so their powers would not go to him. As the manga scan you posted showed, Yhwach was only able to absorb other souls in the second battle because he deliberately put pieces of his soul throughout the Seireietei in the first. If the enemies Quincy vanquish went to him anyways, then there would have been no need to scatter pieces of his soul throughout the Seireitei.

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    • The Hollows have Human souls, and the scan specifies that no matter who dies, their soul will go to Yhwach. By spreading pieces of his soul, he meant the Quincies. Not actual physical souls, we didn't see.

      As shown with Masaki and Katagiri you don't need to drink Yhwach's blood, to get killed by Yhwach's soul manipulatiom abilities..

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    • While Masaki and Katagiri never drank Yhwach's blood, they were still descended from Quincies (who were created by Yhwach) and thus they still had his blood in them (which is why he was able to take their powers). The scan specified that no matter who died in the Vandenreich's battle, their souls would go to Yhwach as he spread pieces of it during the first battle. Yhwach's backstory confirmed that he could give away actual portions of his soul that eventually returned to him. If Haschwalth was talking about the quincies, he would have said just that rather than "pieces of Yhwach's soul."

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    • He could give pieces of his soul to human beings through contact, therefore all who come in contact and killed by Quincies get their soul stolen. There was never mention of him putting his soul in solid objects. If you find a scan of that please provide it. The Quincy's were shown when he said that, so there is no need to say it.

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    • Even if he could give pieces of his soul to others through contact, it is never said in the series if the ones those individuals touch or fight become connected as well. Also, I never said he put his soul into solid objects. In the first scan you posted, when Haschwalth said Yhwach scattered pieces of his soul throughout Seireitei during the previous battle, it did not show any Quincy. It showed an image of the Seireitei. He scattered these pieces throughout the atmosphere. Nanao made an indirect reference to this when she and Shunsui are confronted by Haschwalth. She said she developed her new Kido by analyzing the spiritual energy the Quincy left behind during the previous battle. So, Yhwach scattered his soul in this manner.

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    • Well, the scan aboce just said so. You can see the Quincy below [1]

      You have what evidence again? Speculation of Yhwach putting his soul parts in Reishi form in the atmosphere. Where is the evidence of this? Too me it has no connection, please do better and showing it

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    • As you can see here: [1] and here [2] Nanao says spiritual pressure a.k.a. Reiatsu, not Reishi a.k.a. Spiritual Particles.

      Now where its stated that Yhwach can turn his soul into Reiatsu?

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    • I just looked at it again. When Hascwalth said Yhwach scattered pieces of his soul throughout the Seireitei during the previous battle, it shows an image of the Seireitei. I admit I got my terms mixed up and should have said Reiatsu, but that does not matter because I did not say he turned his soul into Reiatsu or Reiryoku (spirit energy). I was just using it as a comparison. Yhwach left pieces of his soul in the environment just like there were remnants of Quincy reiatsu left over in the environment from the first battle. None of what I've said is speculation. On the contrary, everything you've said is speculation. It was established from early on in the series that Quincies completely extinguish hollows. It's canon. It's fact. This is reconfirmed in the final arc, and nowhere in the final arc is it shown or stated that all enemies quincies contact and/or defeat are absorbed by Yhwach. The only exception to this is the second battle with the Vandereich, and that was because Yhwach scattered his soul throughout the Seireitei as Haschwalth stated.

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    • How did he did it? We have no evidence besides what I said, and that's why you haven't show me anything to validate your theory. Of course your soul will be extinguish if a dude eats it. Show me how Yhwach distributed his souls or concede, because you have nothing to back it up. I already made my point and the scan below the Vandereich shows the Quincy's and Ichigo. The Shinigami and us may never know the truth, but that's the good thing about speculation.

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    • The problem is the story never explains the exact process of how Yhwach distributes his soul, but that does not matter. The story confirms that Yhwach is able to do so, and that is all the evidence I need. Your speculation has no evidence supporting it as the Vandenreich's second battle was the only such case of Quincy enemies being absorbed by Yhwach, and that was because of him littering the Seireitei with pieces of his soul. The panels showing Ichigo and Quincy were just to show that whoever dies Yhwach will gain their souls (as Haschwalth again stated). The reason I started this thread was to ask what people thought about using gigai technology to prevent hollow destruction, not debating things that have already been established by the story as canon. So, I have no intention of conceding to you about something that is off topic and completely irrelevant.

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    • You're entire argument is mood. Because they're not fighting in the Seireitei during the second invasion, but in the Vandereich when Yhwach swapped the dimensions. Proving that its the Quincy themselves, as we never saw Yhwach used his power as you described.

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    • "Mood." Don't you mean "moot?" The swapped dimension encompasses the same area as the Seireitei did. If the pieces of Yhwach's soul weren't in that area, Haschwalth wouldn't have mentioned it (like he did in the scan you provided). Again, if you aren't going to address the gigai topic then please stop replying.

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    • Yes, moot. It does occupy the same area, but the Seireitei is no longer present.Making your point moot as people died in the Vandereich, not in the Seireitei. I will stop replying when you stop making absurd assumptions.

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    • It is not an assumption. It is a fact. If Yhwach did not have pieces of his soul scattered throughout the Seireitei during the previous battle, what would Haschwalth gain by lying to Uryu about it? Stop this baseless argument of yours already.

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    • There is a difference between what you're assuming and facts. Twisting facts to fit your argument is an assumption, until you provide evidence to back up your statement. Nowhere did I said that Jugram was lying. Now bring me those hardcore facts to back up your theory.

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    • I do not need state any more facts, because I do not have a theory. What I have been reaffirming over and over again is canon, and I am not going to list any more facts as I have listed plenty already. Also, that is not what I made this thread for. I started this to see what others thought of a potential technology application that could better the Bleach universe. However, I'm not likely to get any such thoughts now because there are several posts of something off-topic. You keep saying the same despite lacking any evidence, and this is made even more ridiculous by the fact that it is not even your original theory. DarkMuse616 came up with it, and if they find some evidence to back it up they are free to do so (but not on this page that is not what it is for). My last two attempts at telling you this seem not to have gotten stuck in your head. So, let's hope the third time is the charm: if you are not going to talk about the gigai topic then don't reply. I'm done entertaining you.

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    • Alright, still waiting for Yhwach putting his soul in the atmosphere as you stated.

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    • Stop replying.

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    • i think its frantic

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    • Frantic?

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