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Nozomi Shikai

This Discussion is Closed
Please do not edit this discussion.

Regarding her release command, "Kurisuke" isn't a word. The kanji used don't mean anything in Japanese (if anything, that looks like someone is just trying to spell it out in phonetic kanji). In the episode, she is definitely saying "Furishikire" (降りしきれ), which is actually a verb relating to rain. Faceplant (talk) 21:58, July 20, 2011 (UTC)

Inaba Zanpakuto Query

I believe the release command for Inaba Kagerouza's Zanpakutou is incorrect - it should be 狂え (kurue), not 狂い (kurui). Firstly, this can clearly be heard when listening to the episode audio. Secondly, the imperative form of the original verb (kuruu) is "kurue", and as far as I know all Shikai commands use imperative forms.Velorien (talk) 11:57, May 6, 2011 (UTC)

Furthermore, could someone tell me what the source is for the kanji for Raiku? It differs from the kanji given by the TVTokyo captions, which are 莱 空 - "Goosefoot" ( a weed the stalk of which has been used to make walking sticks in China since ancient times, linking it to Raiku's cane form) + "Void/Empty".Velorien (talk) 11:57, May 6, 2011 (UTC)

Komamura Bankai

Shouldn't the translation be "Vidyaraja's Heavenly Punishment, Kalasutra"? Because I just found out that Vidyaraja is a passion-quenching wrath-faced Buddha, and attacking one is apparently traditional grounds for lifetimes of torment in the extreme Buddhist Hell of Kalasutra. --Reikson (talk) 06:13, July 5, 2011 (UTC)

Or, alternatively, "Kalasutra's Heavenly Punishment, Vidyaraja"? --Reikson (talk) 06:15, July 5, 2011 (UTC)
This was actually dealt with some time ago, before the translation corner existed. Check out Talk:Sajin_Komamura/Archive_1#Bankai_translation (might be more of it on Adam's talk page). ~~Ууp <talk> 10:11, July 5, 2011 (UTC)
Huh. --Reikson (talk) 16:34, July 5, 2011 (UTC)

Sayori

Hey, I need the romanization and kanji for Sayori from Episode 173. I also need the romanization and kanji for Sacchi as well (same person - different name). Thanks! TheDevilHand888 (talk) 01:13, October 5, 2010 (UTC)


Episode 314 cast

Episode 314 Cast

Cast listing for Episode 314.

I managed to isolate the names of the two anime-only characters that debuted in Episode 314, "Haruko" and "Ken", in the cast listing during the end credits, and I leave my results here for the wiki's perusal if it's decided to create character pages for those two. As far as I can tell, Haruko (second from top) is voiced by Mamiko Noto. That said, does anyone know who is the voice actor for Ken (fifth from top)?

Also, the katakana of the second-to-last name (sixth from top) reads as Ikemen. I assume that is supposed to refer to this episode's Hollow, but I can't be 100% sure. MarqFJA (talk) 12:56, April 1, 2011 (UTC)

Looks like Ken was played by Toshiharu Sakurai, and whoever this "Ikemen" (prob. from the Japanese for "hot guy") was, he was played by Seirō Ogino. Adam Restling (talk) 22:42, April 1, 2011 (UTC)

Nozomi Kujo

We need clarification here, since someone edited Nozomi's page and stuck the supposed kanji on it. The kanji for her name on her page seems to be 九条 望実. I don't know who supplied it, but I just want to make sure it is correct; additionally, we need to double check and see if her name is "Nozomi Kujo" or "Nozomi Kujō/Kujou". If you need to check the episode that revealed her name itself, it was Episode 318. Please get back to me as soon as your are able. Thanks in advance. Arrancar109 (Talk) 05:03, April 25, 2011 (UTC)

The Japanese reads as "Kujō/Kujou Nozomi," so...--Reikson (talk) 05:10, April 25, 2011 (UTC)

Inaba

Someone placed 因幡 影狼佐 as the kanji for Inaba. I removed it due to being placed improperly but before it goes back up. can I get a confirmation on it as being correct?-- .GodPray  05:13,4/25/2011 

I think you should only add the first two characters, because 因幡 or Inaba stems from 因幡の白兎, which roughly translates to "inabanoshirōsagi" or "Hare of Inaba", referencing the Japanese myth of the same name. JW Talk

Hold up! Was the kanji for Inaba given in the credits? --Reikson (talk) 05:28, April 25, 2011 (UTC)
I have no idea where this comes from. It was placed on the page. That is all I know.--GodPray  05:29,4/25/2011 

Either way, we still need the Kanji for Inaba's full name, "Kageroza Inaba", which was revealed in Episode 319, so the episode credits should have him listed. Let me know as soon as you can. Thanks. Arrancar109 (Talk) 17:27, April 26, 2011 (UTC)

If that is so, then the kanji should be "(影狼佐 因幡, Kageroza Inaba)" which I got from Tangorin. It is actually exactly the same as the previous user uploaded, except he/she did it in the opposite fashion. Also, I only put the first two characters because that was all that was revealed of his name at the time. JW Talk 06:21, April 30, 2011 (UTC)

I'd still like a confirmation from Adam before we put this on the article.--GodPray  06:25,4/30/2011 
I can confirm that those are the kanji for Kagerouza Inaba's name given by the TVTokyo captions.Velorien (talk) 11:47, May 6, 2011 (UTC)

Hirenkyaku

The kanji for Ishida's Hirenkyaku ability are incorrect - they should be 飛簾脚 rather than 飛廉脚, with the middle kanji having a bamboo radical. Reference: manga chapter 122, p.10.Velorien (talk) 12:08, May 6, 2011 (UTC)


Togabito Names

THVIBPage 78
THVIBPage 80
.

Shuren's name can also be spelt as Syuren and Gonjō's can also be spelt as Gunjyo.

Ichimaru-Tsang April 4 2011

Sorry for the trouble, Ichimaru-Tsang! Here's the other image:

Thanks,

JirachiwishTalk 04:53, April 11, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Jirachiwish.

From Ichimaru-TsangHay Jing Tsang (talk) 12:19, April 12, 2011 (UTC)

About "Mediumship"...

Was there ever a Japanese term used in BLEACH to describe those who can see ghosts?

'Cuz the closest I ever found was... 霊能者 (reinōsha), roughly translated as "person with spiritual skill." --Reikson (talk) 01:37, January 29, 2011 (UTC)

Where did you find 霊能者? Can you give me the ch. and pg. #? Adam Restling (talk) 23:33, February 3, 2011 (UTC)
Never said I found it anywhere. If there was, I haven't seen it. Reinōsha was the closest word that I could find in a dictionary, that could possibly apply to the article. That's why I was asking. --Reikson (talk) 00:47, February 4, 2011 (UTC)

I know the term has been there since before it was released, but chapter 424 page 7 (as Ichigo, Isshin, Karin & Yuzu leave the house) Ichigo says something about Karin being a high spec medium if that helps. ~~Ууp <talk> 12:08, February 4, 2011 (UTC)

Ran'Tao - Symbol on Back

Ran-Tao Marking (ep96)

What does the symbol on Ran'Tao's back mean please? According to her article it is something to do with her powers being sealed. ~~Ууp <talk> 11:29, February 6, 2011 (UTC)


Not sure; it may just be something they made up to look *kewl*, but I'll investigate further. Adam Restling (talk) 12:40, February 23, 2011 (UTC)

Zanketsu

Ep66Zanketsu

Hi. Can you please give me the kanji from this image and their meanings? WD Converse 17:20, February 14, 2011 (UTC)

The zan part is 残 "linger, remain; leave behind". Since ketsu (ケツ) is written in katakana, it's hard to know what word was intended, tho it would be funny if it ketsu "ass" XD. I missed that 'sode; maybe the context of its appearance would help me out? Adam Restling (talk) 12:44, February 23, 2011 (UTC)

Am I allowed to answer this as a Japanese? Well if you look at the subtitles above, (↑) it says that the sign means "left-over ass". Well that's correct. the kanji/katakana of the word is 残ケツ if that's what you meant. JapaneseOPfan :: Talk 14:23, March 26, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, you're right; but I still would've appreciated somebody giving the context so I could make my own judgment (I hesitate to DL and/or watch myself because I my VLC f**ks up so much, and so does Flash tarry unless it's all you're doing on the Internet), as subtitles have also given us sh** like Koutotsu = "The Cleaner" (it does not) and "Heaven-Shocking Lunar Fang". Adam Restling (talk) 23:22, April 1, 2011 (UTC)

Adam, if you still want the context, it is during the mod soul training. Renji and Ichigo are forced to place their swords in cases that have these tags on them that make fun of their zanpakuto names.--GodPray  23:35,4/1/2011 

MASKED Character Book

For some semblance of order, I am putting all masked related stuff in this section. Tinni (Talk) 05:59, August 22, 2010 (UTC)

Kubo's comments on new characters

I uploaded the two pages from Kubo's interview in which he comments on the new characters. It would be a great if we could get a general gist of what Kubo is saying for their profiles. Thanks. Tinni (Talk) 17:44, August 28, 2010 (UTC)

Romanization of Hollowfication

MASKEDPage 36

As you know, the wiki currently translates (虚(ホロウ)化, Horōka) as "Hollowfication," which we have been using as such for various articles across the site. However, as the exert from the MASKED databook to the right shows, Ichigo's act of donning his Hollow mask is referred to as "Hollowize," implying that the process of becoming a Hollow would be more correctly translated as "Hollowization." This would further suggest that the process of becoming an Arrancar would actually be called "Arrancarization/Arrancarize." Now, I know that we have had some problems with the databook's romanizations in the past, but this one is fairly consistent with what we know, as "-ification" and "-ization" can be easily mixed up for one another. Is the databook's romanization correct, or should we just stick with what we already have right now? I only ask as a peremptory measure, since converting all of the "Hollowfy"s and "Hollowfication"s into "Hollowize"s and "Hollowization"s would be another huge undertaking. Mohrpheus (Talk) 17:53, February 7, 2011 (UTC)

It's weird that Horouka by itself is translated "Hollowize", since it refers to process/effect only; translating "Hollowize" as in the verb should be something like Horoukasuru, with the auxiliary verb suru turning the noun Horouka into a verb.
But I digress XD. It's up to you guys and the consensus, I suppose, whether you want to change it to "Hollowize : Hollowization"; but the English and some of the romanizations in MASKED are kind of a poor guide anyway: why is it Shuhei Hisagi, but Syunsui Kyoraku or whatever? The letters shu and syu both represent the same sound in Japanese, but belong to different romanization "schemes" (Hepburn and Nippon systems respectively, I think). Why are some long ous written out thus (Sousuke Aizen, Toushiro Hitsugaya), but some reduced to just o (Kaname Tosen, Toushiro Hitsugaya)?
I think on the issue of Hollowfy/ication vs. Hollowize/ation, it's kind of a toss-up, esp. since we only have one of the possible forms, "Hollowize", in MASKED itself. Not to mention that, in his special bonus to vol. 36(? I think it was), Kubo printed Grimmjow's last name as "Jaegerjaquez", but then changed his mind (back?) to "Jaegerjaques" for MASKED.
What do you other guys think? Adam Restling (talk) 11:46, February 8, 2011 (UTC)
Don't the Romanization more or less signify the same thing? I suggest that, other than a mention of the officially-used Romanization in the main article for Hollowfication (and Arrancarfication, if there is any...), we don't change anything. --Reikson (talk) 14:35, February 8, 2011 (UTC)

Unmasked

Poem

I will place the opening poem from UNMASKED here, so Adam can translate it when next he gets on. JW Talk 11:54, June 4, 2011 (UTC)

I believe I would translate this thusly:

Abaitamono ha yokubou to kyomu Ushinaumono ha nanimonai

The things exposed, desire and nothingness The thing lost, nothing

Adam Restling (talk) 10:52, June 8, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks Adam. Good to see you back on~~Ууp <talk> 10:58, June 8, 2011 (UTC)

Yammy's "Pet"

Can I get a romanization of the name of Yammy's pet please (2nd picture in gallery above, middle of right hand page). I've seen "Kukkapurro" being bandied about, but I'd like confirmation of that. Also, I think I can see the kanji for Arrancar in there, am I right? ~~Ууp <talk> 11:27, June 10, 2011 (UTC)

There doesn't seem to be an official romanization for Yammy's Fracci-hound; the forms like "Kukkapuuro" etc. are just based on the katakana (Kukkapūro). Someone on Bleach Asylum said they had an idea on a possible inspiration for the name, but no official romanization has appeared in any of the scans I've been able to see (though I'm a bit behind).
The Kanji on the Espada page seem to be just, as the English says, the same "Aspects of Death" ("'Death Figures'") each represents, as first seen in the chapter "Tyrant of Skulls". Adam Restling (talk) 11:48, July 6, 2011 (UTC)

Hollow Hole Locations

Apparently picture 3 above gives the locations of the Espada's Hollow holes. Is that correct and if so, can we get the location of the unknown ones please (Harribel, Baraggan, Zommari, Szayel Aporro, Arroniero). Thanks ~~Ууp <talk> 12:20, June 10, 2011 (UTC)

As Bleach Asylum's czeliate provided:
Baraggan = center (of) chest
Harribel = bottom abdomen - womb
Zommari = right nipple
Szayelaporro = glans (head of the penis)
Aaroniero = left thigh (area). Adam Restling (talk) 12:03, July 6, 2011 (UTC)


Nestle to Night Poem

Poem from Nestle To Night novel in UNMASKED ~~Ууp <talk> 10:22, June 13, 2011 (UTC)

Yayzorz, an easy poem. The words are all in kana, I suppose to show the simpler or more "childlike" diction of the dog (!).
Yamī Yamī
Bokura no sekai ni
mata
yoru ga kita yo
"Yammy Yammy
To our world,
again,
night has come"
Tragic stuff.
The element mata usu. means "again", but can also mean "still, also" (although "still, yet" is usu. handled by the word mada). Adam Restling (talk) 11:13, July 19, 2011 (UTC)


Genga's Bakkōtō

Is its name Kyōkaku or Kakuyoku, because somewhere on the page it mentions Kyōkaku, but they say Kakuyoku in both the English and Japanese versions. Its kanji is 角翼, Horned Wings. Master D (talk) 22:27, July 8, 2011 (UTC)

It's Kakuyoku, since you have to account for the on'yōmi of 翼 (tsubasa, meaning "wing"), which is yoku. --Reikson (talk) 22:55, July 8, 2011 (UTC)


Division Recruitment

In Bleach's Official Bootleg, captans and vice-captains were asked to answer questions regarding recruitment. The characters used the word "men" repeatedly, which I found inappropriate, though I know the word can be understood as a person of either sex.

I would like to point out that the original Japanese version used the gender neutral noun "者". I suggest that we use the word "persons" instead of "men" or any better alternatives to "men". Even Iba used "者" for his first answer -- "[者] who overflow with masculinity. " For Yachiru, she used "hito" (人) instead of "yatsu" (ヤツ) therefore it would more accurate for us to use "people" instead of "guys", regardless of what the official translation is.

Wintersbreath (talk) 04:25, July 17, 2011 (UTC)Wintersbreath

This is one of those words that's sometimes tough to translate, 者 -sha, -ja, -mono. Gone are the days when English man simply meant "person", and "woman, man" were usu. either cwēn, wer or compounds of man like wīf-man(n) ("female-person") and wæpen-man(n) ("weapon-person").
Since 者 is generally gender-neutral, a (derivative) noun suffix, I'd say it should be translated as -er or ~ one or similarly neutral English constructions when used, especially as such a derivative suffix. "Person/people" or even "one(s)" could also be used for 人 hito, depending on context for whether singular or plural, and even for yatsu, though this last is a vulgar/brusque term for the like. It could be noted, however, that English guys is often used as a kind of collective pseudo-neutral in the plural. Adam Restling (talk) 10:39, July 24, 2011 (UTC)

Komamura's Bankai

A mod sent me here to ask this, I posted it on Talk:Sajin_Komamura first:

Myouou -> Vidyaraja

Kokujou -> Naraka

Kokujou is the Japanese term for Buddhist hell. And Naraka is Buddhist hell. Also Kalasutra sounds like Kamasutra, which is awful. Just type "Kalasutra" in Google, it returns "Did you mean KAMASUTRA?". But most importantly this page explains it better:

http://www.wisdomlib.org/definition/naraka/index.html

"Naraka or Niraya (Tib: dmyal.ba) is the name given to one of the worlds of greatest suffering, usually translated into English as "hell" or "purgatory"." Xcetron (talk) 02:47, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Im not sure what the question is or point your attempting to bring up.

Kokujō Tengen Myō'ō (黒縄天譴明王, Vidyaraja of Kalasutra's Heavenly Punishment; Viz "Divine Retribution, Black Ropes of Ruination")

Vidyaraja are the third level of the Buddhist pantheon they are Wisdom Kings who are the embodiment of the wheel of injunction and teach through fear, shocking nonbelievers into faith. Kalasutra is the one of the hot "hells/naraka" of Buddhism.

Im not understanding your meaning seeing as you didnt seem to make the connection to what kalasutra was comparing it to kamasutra (which is completely unrelated and not awful) secondly the translation is correctly given its deeper meaning is something only Kubo as the writer would know. We cant make assumptions to what his intention was and this topic has been done over to death by various users and translators. Hence your not really presenting stuff thats not already known. Is this a translation issue at all?--Salubri (Talk) 03:25, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I'll try to explain it better. What I mean is that Kokujou means Hell, and Hell means Naraka. And that Kalasutra is one of the "Hot Narakas" of Hell(Naraka), like it says here:

http://www.wisdomlib.org/definition/naraka/index.html

"Cold Narakas

  • Arbuda and – the "blister" Naraka
  • Nirarbuda and – the "burst blister" Naraka
  • Atata and – the Naraka of shivering
  • Hahava and – the Naraka of lamentation
  • Huhuva and – the Naraka of chattering teeth
  • Utpala and – the "blue lotus" Naraka
  • Padma and – the "lotus" Naraka
  • Mahapadma and – the "great lotus" Naraka

Each lifetime in these Narakas is twenty times the length of the one before it.

Hot Narakas

  • Sanjiva and – the "reviving" Naraka.
  • Kalasutra and – the "black thread" Naraka.
  • Samghata and – the "crushing" Naraka.
  • Raurava and – the "screaming" Naraka.
  • Maharaurava and – the "great screaming" Naraka.
  • Tapana and – the "heating" Naraka.
  • Pratapana and – the "great heating" Naraka.
  • Avici and – the "uninterrupted" Naraka."

So what I mean is that it should be Naraka not one of the "Hot Narakas". Xcetron (talk) 10:45, July 22, 2011 (UTC)

I think there is some confusion here we arent in the business of changing around translation meanings for kicks. This what the translation is. All that you have said is that you wanna change the hell. Kubo decides whats the terms used. When its even incorrect spanish, he doesnt speak spanish so its still correct when he does it cause he wrote it that way and thats what the site follows. If he wants to use Kalasutra then thats what it is regardless if its not one of the ones you want. Also you still had not made a point your saying basically that it shouldnt be a naraka but a naraka. Which doesn't make sense.--Salubri (Talk) 13:11, July 22, 2011 (UTC)

I dunno exactly what the issue is here (if there really is any issue at all), but since I was the first one (I believe) to volunteer the element Kalasutra here, I thought it important to weigh in.
Japanese kokujou means "black rope(s)", and is the Japanese translation of Kalasutra, derived from the Sanskrit elements kala- "black" and sutra- "warp, thread". The latter, I *think*, is related to English sew. Kalasutra is, as reiterated above, one of the hot Narakas (Buddhist Hells). When referring to his version of Hell, though, Kubo usu. uses the Sino-Japanese name Jigoku, referring to the di yu or "earth prison" of that set of beliefs. But, often, the two are blended and somewhat interchangeable. But Kalasutra is certainly not "Hell" as in "the only Hell/Naraka", so I don't get the problem.
Everybody's favorite sex manual, the Kamasutra, combines Sanskrit kama- "love" with the same element sutra- (apparently, here, to be understood as shorthand for "threaded-together pages of the book"), and is far more widely known.
My point is this: Kubo uses lots of elements draw from Buddhism and the like, though translated, in BLEACH. Enmakoorogi references Yama Raja, and myouou is a translation ("wisdom king") of vidyaraja. Thus, in keeping with this, I likewise glossed kokujou as "Kalasutra". So there doesn't actually seem to be any problem at all. But no, Kokujou is not a Japanese catch-all for "Hell"; these are usu. furnished by either Jigoku or the phonetically-adapted Naraku.
If I somehow missed something, please post here with your feedback :). Adam Restling (talk) 19:59, July 22, 2011 (UTC)


Nozomi Kujō's Zanpakuto

Apparently, Nozomi's Zanpakuto has two translations, as this was written on her page: Arazomeshigure (退紅時雨, Wind Death; Back when the rain red).

I'm not sure which one it is, as they are both different meanings. We need to be verified on what her Zanpakuto name translates to. And if it helps, she releases her Zanpakuto in Episode 331 of the anime. Arrancar109 (Talk) 16:02, July 19, 2011 (UTC)

"Wind Death" is Hisagi's Kazeshini. Looking at tangorin, there does not seem to be any way 退紅時雨 could mean "wind death". According to the edit history, Jirachiwish added it [1]. Maybe he copy/pasted template from Hisagi's page or something. Dunno. ~~Ууp <talk> 20:32, July 19, 2011 (UTC)

I had a feeling, but the other meaning doesn't make any sense, hence why I wanted it verified. I haven't really touched the translation template on that page, but I'm beginning that I think I should until we can have verification as to what Arazomeshigure means. Arrancar109 (Talk) 20:42, July 19, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, looks like something that could have a lot of potential meanings and should be left up to Adam or Marq to settle rather than users guessing from online translators as seems to be the case right now. ~~Ууp <talk> 20:45, July 19, 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, sorry about that! I added the translation template in for her Zanpakutō's name, which was already on the page, but I forgot to blank out the Wind Death thing. Sorry --JW Talk 05:54, July 20, 2011 (UTC)

If those Kanji are correct, then her Zanpakutou name means "faded scarlet late autumn shower/drizzle". No "Wind Death" from Hisagi, that's for sure, but arazome sure is a rare word, it seems. Adam Restling (talk) 20:14, July 22, 2011 (UTC)
Thanks Adam. It's on the articles now. We've had a couple of users disagreeing on the translation and indeed the actual word used for her release command. We have it as "Rain Down 挥酒沷降, kuriske" on the article (don't know where that came from), but some seem to think it is "Rain Incessantly 降りしきれ Furishikire". Which is correct (or are any of that correct)? ~~Ууp <talk> 20:34, July 22, 2011 (UTC)
This being a non-canon anime issue (and so no handy manga raws to refer to in the matter), the best I could hope for was to search the Kanji and see if some Japanese page would throw me a bone.
When I did so, the page I found seemed to (*tentatively*) confirm that Arazomeshigure's release call was "downpour/rain without end" (降りしきれ furishikire), as the latter example above gave. This combines furu "drop, fall (also used of rain and snow)" + shikiru "do constantly, repeat over and over". The above Kanji, 挥酒沷降, seem like some wacko warping of it, perhaps copied from a Chinese-language adaptation website; while the rendering kuriske isn't Japanese, where all "syllables" must end in either a vowel or n. Adam Restling (talk) 10:13, July 24, 2011 (UTC)


Komamura's Bankai

A mod sent me here to ask this, I posted it on Talk:Sajin_Komamura first:

Myouou -> Vidyaraja

Kokujou -> Naraka

Kokujou is the Japanese term for Buddhist hell. And Naraka is Buddhist hell. Also Kalasutra sounds like Kamasutra, which is awful. Just type "Kalasutra" in Google, it returns "Did you mean KAMASUTRA?". But most importantly this page explains it better:

http://www.wisdomlib.org/definition/naraka/index.html

"Naraka or Niraya (Tib: dmyal.ba) is the name given to one of the worlds of greatest suffering, usually translated into English as "hell" or "purgatory"." Xcetron (talk) 02:47, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Im not sure what the question is or point your attempting to bring up.

Kokujō Tengen Myō'ō (黒縄天譴明王, Vidyaraja of Kalasutra's Heavenly Punishment; Viz "Divine Retribution, Black Ropes of Ruination")

Vidyaraja are the third level of the Buddhist pantheon they are Wisdom Kings who are the embodiment of the wheel of injunction and teach through fear, shocking nonbelievers into faith. Kalasutra is the one of the hot "hells/naraka" of Buddhism.

Im not understanding your meaning seeing as you didnt seem to make the connection to what kalasutra was comparing it to kamasutra (which is completely unrelated and not awful) secondly the translation is correctly given its deeper meaning is something only Kubo as the writer would know. We cant make assumptions to what his intention was and this topic has been done over to death by various users and translators. Hence your not really presenting stuff thats not already known. Is this a translation issue at all?--Salubri (Talk) 03:25, July 18, 2011 (UTC)

Ok, I'll try to explain it better. What I mean is that Kokujou means Hell, and Hell means Naraka. And that Kalasutra is one of the "Hot Narakas" of Hell(Naraka), like it says here:

http://www.wisdomlib.org/definition/naraka/index.html

"Cold Narakas

  • Arbuda and – the "blister" Naraka
  • Nirarbuda and – the "burst blister" Naraka
  • Atata and – the Naraka of shivering
  • Hahava and – the Naraka of lamentation
  • Huhuva and – the Naraka of chattering teeth
  • Utpala and – the "blue lotus" Naraka
  • Padma and – the "lotus" Naraka
  • Mahapadma and – the "great lotus" Naraka

Each lifetime in these Narakas is twenty times the length of the one before it.

Hot Narakas

  • Sanjiva and – the "reviving" Naraka.
  • Kalasutra and – the "black thread" Naraka.
  • Samghata and – the "crushing" Naraka.
  • Raurava and – the "screaming" Naraka.
  • Maharaurava and – the "great screaming" Naraka.
  • Tapana and – the "heating" Naraka.
  • Pratapana and – the "great heating" Naraka.
  • Avici and – the "uninterrupted" Naraka."

So what I mean is that it should be Naraka not one of the "Hot Narakas". Xcetron (talk) 10:45, July 22, 2011 (UTC)

I think there is some confusion here we arent in the business of changing around translation meanings for kicks. This what the translation is. All that you have said is that you wanna change the hell. Kubo decides whats the terms used. When its even incorrect spanish, he doesnt speak spanish so its still correct when he does it cause he wrote it that way and thats what the site follows. If he wants to use Kalasutra then thats what it is regardless if its not one of the ones you want. Also you still had not made a point your saying basically that it shouldnt be a naraka but a naraka. Which doesn't make sense.--Salubri (Talk) 13:11, July 22, 2011 (UTC)

I dunno exactly what the issue is here (if there really is any issue at all), but since I was the first one (I believe) to volunteer the element Kalasutra here, I thought it important to weigh in.
Japanese kokujou means "black rope(s)", and is the Japanese translation of Kalasutra, derived from the Sanskrit elements kala- "black" and sutra- "warp, thread". The latter, I *think*, is related to English sew. Kalasutra is, as reiterated above, one of the hot Narakas (Buddhist Hells). When referring to his version of Hell, though, Kubo usu. uses the Sino-Japanese name Jigoku, referring to the di yu or "earth prison" of that set of beliefs. But, often, the two are blended and somewhat interchangeable. But Kalasutra is certainly not "Hell" as in "the only Hell/Naraka", so I don't get the problem.
Everybody's favorite sex manual, the Kamasutra, combines Sanskrit kama- "love" with the same element sutra- (apparently, here, to be understood as shorthand for "threaded-together pages of the book"), and is far more widely known.
My point is this: Kubo uses lots of elements draw from Buddhism and the like, though translated, in BLEACH. Enmakoorogi references Yama Raja, and myouou is a translation ("wisdom king") of vidyaraja. Thus, in keeping with this, I likewise glossed kokujou as "Kalasutra". So there doesn't actually seem to be any problem at all. But no, Kokujou is not a Japanese catch-all for "Hell"; these are usu. furnished by either Jigoku or the phonetically-adapted Naraku.
If I somehow missed something, please post here with your feedback :). Adam Restling (talk) 19:59, July 22, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the info, if you would answer some doubts I have it would be great. I read here [2] various things about the bankai's translation. Two of them were:

1)Myouou -> Vidyaraja

"Myouou is the Sino-Japanese translation, "enlightened/illumined king," of the Sanskrit vidyarājā "wisdom king."" - Salubri

Some more info about Vidyaraja:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisdom_King

2)Kokujou -> Naraka

"Kokujou is the Japanese name for the Buddhist hell--or Naraka--" - Salubri

So that's why in the first place I stated those two points. And then I mentioned Kalasutra being one of the "Hot Narakas", since Naraka means hell as stated here:

http://www.wisdomlib.org/definition/naraka/index.html

"Naraka or Niraya (Tib: dmyal.ba) is the name given to one of the worlds of greatest suffering, usually translated into English as "hell" or "purgatory"."

So shouldn't it be "Kokujou(Naraka) Tengen(Divine Punishment) Myouou(Vidyaraja)". In other words "Vidyaraja of Naraka's Divine Punishment". Xcetron (talk) 11:25, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

In this case as Adam explained 'Kalasutra' is the japanese translation of 'Kokujo' and the reason its used is to designate a specific hell where as using 'naraka' is like using the blanket term for hell, which is not what Kubo is saying. If you read the above Adam clearly explains why Kalasutra is used over the term Naraka. The meaning of Kokujo is 'black rope' and Kalasutra (black thread) is the actual definition of a specific naraka in this case, Kokujo means to be more specific Kalasutra. To place it as you suggest would be making a broad statement of many kinds of hells when a specific one is given in the translation.--Salubri (Talk) 15:23, July 29, 2011 (UTC)

I kind of understand now. Thanks for clearing things up. Xcetron (talk) 05:47, July 30, 2011 (UTC)

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