Talk:Retsu Unohana/Archive 3

Other weapons...
In the latest chapter Unohana is seen using aditional sets of blades to stab Zaraki...what are those, daggars or something like that? Darksusanoo (talk) 07:37, January 23, 2013 (UTC)

Remove the protection, the article's in shambles.
The latest chapter plot needs a lot of work, since some sentences make no sense actually. Like the part that says that Unohana "didn't need" to use the tricks the last time they fought. This makes no friggin' sense, it should go something like "didn't have the time" or "couldn't find an opening" to use those tricks. Kenpachi is supposed to have become weaker, not stronger. Xfing (talk) 11:24, January 24, 2013 (UTC)

The summary was written when MangaPanda was the only source, hence the difference. The article will be updated to reflect more accurate translations. 12:26, January 24, 2013 (UTC)

Well, even in the Mangapanda version it said "didn't have the time", not "need". Oh well no harm done. I only wonder why the article was edit locked in the first place, doesn't seem like there's been much vandalism here Xfing (talk) 12:51, January 24, 2013 (UTC)

I don't know either myself lol I guess whoever did lock it was just being paranoid. 13:17, January 24, 2013 (UTC)


 * Articles are locked when there are huge new revelations made and it involves the articles!! With updated releases the articles then become targets for inexperienced editors who then make a muck up and edit wars begin as people want to add their opinion or only want to edit that one "current event" page!! Thus the result is they are locked as the team discusses the best way to address large scale revelations!! All of the team can edit protected pages so there will be a concentrate effort to fix translation errors from the horrendous scanlators who clearly can't arrange a proper english sentence in proper context at times!! Closing discussion!!

Swordsmanship Skills
In the section where it says that Unohana is a master swordsmanship specialist it says that she has never been seen in battle when in the latest chapter she has obviously been seen battling against kenpachi. Should this be changed? (Himelover567 (talk) 11:00, January 25, 2013 (UTC))


 * The sentence in question has been changed> Mohrpheus   (Talk)  17:23, January 25, 2013 (UTC)

Hakuda
I think maybe she should be listed as a Hakuda expert if not master. In her fight with Zaraki she is stressing fighting with your sword and using your other hand for attacks.
 * Thats not Hakuda. it is a style of Zanjutsu.--


 * When your attacking with your hand and not a sword it is definitely hakuda. --Kenpachi Yachiru (talk) 10:20, January 28, 2013 (UTC)
 * It is Zanjutsu. It is a swordstyle that utilizes both a sword and other form of attack for maximum damage. It is not Hakuda.--

Unohana's bankai revealed
But it's not quite clear what exactly it did. It looked like it created an illusion of Kenpachi and Unohana's flesh melting, leaving just bones, and then Kenpachi unlocked his full strength. What's even more confusing that Unohana's bankai is called Minazuki. So that flying manta was never her shikai to begin with? Will-O-Wisp (talk)
 * As a starter it just looks like it mannipulates blood... --Gojita (talk) 10:18, February 13, 2013 (UTC)Gojita

http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/526/5

According to the above, she unleashes Bankai. Are they correct or is it a mistranslation? I suspect the former, but wanna make sure. TomServo101 (Talk)  10:18, February 13, 2013 (UTC)

Ok to make this clear to everyone interested in this topic. The content for this is of great concern. In the entire run of bleach the content for a zanpakuto release has probably never been so problematic. The issue here is that 1.) there appears to be no bankai name given as Minizuki is the name of her zanpakuto in general, this is confirmed in all 3 databooks. 2.) It is not really remotely clear what it even does. One thought was blood, we still dont know what it does. Someone mentioned the events following the "release". That makes it even further unclear and confusing as to what it even does. 3.) If we go by the chapter with what we see then the zanpakuto has no relation at all to the flying manta ray-like creature (also confirmed in datebooks). Therefore its questionable about this "banaki", as stated in the series itself: "No Zanpakutō in existence has a Shikai and a Bankai that use unrelated abilities". In turn if content is placed, there will likely be no viable bankai name and there can be only a listing of what ifs and maybes that are not clearly defined in the bankai section. At this point im Just simply relaying the facts of the situation.--

So do you suggest that for now it's left blank? TomServo101 (Talk)  11:31, February 13, 2013 (UTC)

It's pure speculation on my part, but I think Unohana summoned the manta around herself and Kenpachi, ending up in its guts. But I'm at a loss when I try to explain what happened next and what was the purpose of using bankai anyway. Will-O-Wisp (talk)

I would say leave a note with that section, to the effect that 'until we can get a better read on what it does, we will not be entertaining requests to update the section' (I know it's protected). With that in mind, does anyone know where the raws can be found, just so we can confirm we're not going on a wild goose chase? TomServo101 (Talk)  12:23, February 13, 2013 (UTC)

According to 2ch (obviously, we'll need the RAW before including that on the article) the names are different. The Bankai name is 皆尽, while the Shikai is 肉雫唼. It just happens that both are read as "minazuki", so to non-japanese people it looks like both names are the same. - Gorenja (talk) 13:17, February 13, 2013 (UTC)

My only question here is aimed at Salubri. While I don't deny that it was said that a Zanpakuto's Shikai and Bankai cannot have different abilities, I feel that this rule was already broken with Soi Fon's Jakuho Raikoben, unless I'm seriously misreading as to what it does. Schiffy (talk) 13:22, February 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * Suì-Fēng's abilities aside, the term is "not related" not that they must be identical!! Anyway let's just calm down until we get more information from our official translators we can rely more on!!


 * Damn, this always happens when a new chapter comes out. So much speculation that the talk pages get trampled with theories. I think it's even worse this week since there was a week without a chapter, and all the pent up rage of Kubo's readers (myself included) has been restrained longer than usual. Anyway, yeah, waiting for more official information would be best. Schiffy (talk) 14:07, February 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * On the point about Soi Fon abilities, I thing they are related by simply her shikai being "Death in Two Steps", and her bankai being death in one step LOL--D38edooa (talk) 14:13, February 13, 2013 (UTC)

Trying not to speculate, but I think her bankai releases toxic gases (sort of like agent orange) and kills anything in its path. To me it works because her shikai is able to heal people with what I assume is gastric acid, so her bankai would be the polar opposite, which would also fit into her "split" personality. She also said she learned kido so that she could improve her fighting. We saw her turn into bone, so perhaps her bankai affects her as well, and she cannot use her shikai ability when in bankai, so she learned kido to heal herself. Again, this is really out there, but in my opinion it is more logical than creating a "dream world," as many have stated. Thoughts? -- 14:19, February 13, 2013 (UTC)


 * Regarding Sui Feng's Zanpakuto, the theme seems to be one of "Easy Kills," rather than having a specific ability. According to Gorenja (above), there are different Kanji with a similar reading, which means the Bankai may have a different meaning.  However, she maintains a theme: Minashikai was made of a gas, and Minabankai seems to be a sort of acid.  From running the Kanji through terrible online translators, the gist I seem to be getting from it is Minashikai is about cleansing, and Minabankai is about everybody being "pure."  Putting the Shikai ability with her comment about Kaidou right before she used her Bankai, it seems like it manages to amp up the healing capabilities and possibly remove pain from those within its effect.  Furthermore, both have a strong poison theme; poisons can sometimes be used to heal in real life, including anesthetics.Gigawolf1 (talk) 14:21, February 13, 2013 (UTC)

Bankai's red note
I know this is only an aesthetic issue, but instead of letting that odd red note, why don't we put the name, a picture, describe the release and place a simple note that the effect isn't entirely clear yet? Thunder God Cid (talk) 02:11, February 14, 2013 (UTC)

I second this. It's not like there is no information available on her release whatsoever. We have a name, an image and the procedure she uses to release it. I say we add what information we know and leave the abilities section as "Not yet revealed" while at the same time locking the page. Rootsofjustice (talk) 23:11, February 14, 2013 (UTC)


 * We are not entertaining requests of any kind in relation to what goes in this section. We are following our usual process, waiting for the translation corner to sign off on the translation and then we will determine how to proceed from there. Thank you for your concern.--

Translations
Normally I want nothing to do with this place; but for the sake of it, and because I dislike looking at stuff like this, I am going to provide you with the better translation.

Shikai was 'Purify the Flesh'; unless Kubo changed it.

Bankai is 皆尽 -Everything is Exhausted. Just sayin'. Anyway I'm out of your hair now. AnimeQueen9112 (talk) 04:20, February 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * We have our own translator. You can leave now--


 * I am Japanese, just saying. Anyway I'm gone now AnimeQueen9112 (talk) 04:34, February 19, 2013 (UTC)
 * How nice for you--

Trivial: Scar between colarbones
I'm not sure if this is worth mentioning or not, but in episode 228 a filler episode (with the beach and what not), Unohana's hair was tied back and there was no visible scar between her collarbones Dblqaz (talk) 08:53, February 19, 2013 (UTC)

Filler is non-canon. Remember this was long before the chapter showing her scar came out. Nothing but a common Anime screw up.--Yomiko-chan (talk) 09:22, February 19, 2013 (UTC)


 * Indeed, that episode is based on the Bleach on the Beach Omake chapter in which Unohana does not even appear, the creators of the Anime just had her present to extend it into one of the most ridiculous episodes ever made of Bleach!! Like the Magic Lamp Episode those sorts are not even worth mentioning since they are not even close to Canon!!

Latest
Riiiight, we're officially in the poo here. Unohana is really dead on the face of things, and there's no further exposition on what her Bankai does; what can we do with the current state of affairs? I doubt Kubo'll give us anymore on it, so we'll have to decide what to do about the note. Any suggestions? TomServo101 (Talk)  13:50, February 20, 2013 (UTC)

Actually, no. There's no need to just add unsure information just because we are in a rush. Although I am pretty sure that Unohana's Bankai really melt everything around (cnet's translation make it look even more real), it's still open to interpretation. Unless everyone agree that it can really melt things. Seems so, really. HOWEVER, regarding the Bankai's shape itself. The article describes it as a blade covered in a liquid. I believe the blade itself is made of the liquid, though: http://mangahead.com/index.php/Manga-English-Scan/Bleach/Bleach-526-English-Scan/07.jpg?action=big&size=original Here we can see the "blade" of her Bankai is a straight sword. However, in the page before that, the shape of the Bankai makes pretty clear there was no straight blade: http://s3.mangahead.com/mangas/Manga-English-Scan/Bleach/Bleach-526-English-Scan/06.jpg So the red liquid actually gathers in the sword's hilt to shape a "blade". It's not simply covering it. The colorspread in the chapter of this week also suggests it (look how the "blade" gets thiner on some parts): http://mangahead.com/index.php/Manga-English-Scan/Bleach/Bleach-527-English-Scan/01.jpg?action=big&size=original&fromthumbnail=true - Gorenja (talk) 15:53, February 20, 2013 (UTC)

Whats already there is what we have, there is nothing to be done. We do not speculate what it does unless it stated or basically clear. Thats just something everyone will have to deal with, until years later when a databook finally comes out.--

Inventing Zanjutsu
In her "Powers & Abilities" section, specifically under "Master Swordsman", Restu is incorrectly credited with inventing the art of killing. Both BadKarma's and Cnet's translations of chapter 523 confirm that she didn't actually invent it, rather Shunsui was just apologizing for having the two fight under the pretense of "introducing zanjutsu" to Zaraki. Blackstar1 (talk) 16:09, March 29, 2013 (UTC)

As far as I know, we have been using Cnet as our primary source ever since Ju-Ni stopped doing scanlations. Unless someone wants to take it up with the Translation Corner, I think it would be safe to make the correction. Mohrpheus  (Talk)  16:25, March 29, 2013 (UTC)


 * Hmmm it doesnt say she created Zanjutsu, it states the Art of Killing, not the art of swordmanship which is very different given Swordsmanship can be used defensively!! She has been stated as a diabolical criminal, the worst in Soul Society's history, so I guess it is meant to reflect her previous bouts of slaughter and mastering every way to use a blade to kill a person, hence the killing part!! So it's not needed to change however, both of those have different translations on that topic!!

Hey what do you mean?-- User:Jmootam1999 Loves Naruto 12:26, March 30, 2013 (UTC)

Death
Although Unohana received a seemingly fatal blow from Kenpachi, the same thing happened to Byakuya, who is still alive. Until it is officially confirmed that Unohana is dead, the article should be changed back to her still being alive.Steveo920, 00:35 March 30, 2013
 * We were outright told that she is dead - she more or less said so herself. There is nothing to contradict this. Byakuya turned out to be alive, so we changed his article accordingly. If that's the case here, then we will do it. Until then, we are not making assumptions. Mohrpheus   (Talk)  15:07, March 30, 2013 (UTC)


 * When was it stated that she truly died? True, Unohana felt certain she is going to die, but the same was said for Byakuya. Steveo920, 20:26, March 39, 2013


 * As already said, she stated she was now going to die, she is a healer, a very experienced one at that, she knows when someone is dying!! If it's stated in the Manga, it goes in the article unless otherwise proven wrong!!

Unlocking
Can you guys unlock this page as well? I see some edits that are needed, and would like to help. TechGenusMaster (talk) 16:12, April 7, 2013 (UTC)

Is there a reason why this page is still locked? It needs some editing --Shinitenshi (talk) 23:06, April 18, 2013 (UTC)
 * Such as?

The history section, particularly the stuff that happens before the TBTP arc. It's somewhat disjointed.--Shinitenshi (talk) 23:13, April 18, 2013 (UTC)

Not to mention the 13+ incorrect capitalization of Reiatsu! XP I am sure there are other things too. 01:36, April 19, 2013 (UTC)

Hidden blade
Since Unohana used hidden blade to wound Kenpachi during their fight shouldn't the blade be added to the article as her equipment? Night486 (talk) 18:25, May 9, 2013 (UTC)Night486

Arrancar arc
I'd just like to know why my edit was reverted. I tried to add that she was present at the captains meeting in chapter 188 in the Arrancar arc. It was referenced and true information so I'm slightly confused as to why it shouldn't be on her page. If someone could tell me why I'd be grateful. --Ginhikari (talk) 19:41, May 19, 2013 (UTC)


 * A simple appearance isnt noteworthy. She is principle character in the series, if she was rarely thought about or seen then it would be significant enough to warrant an appearance mention. It therefore would go without saying that she already is expected to be there. If her role was wider then yes that would be enough to warrant a edit.--

Ok, I understand and you're correct. But if thats the case shouldn't we remove that information from Kyōraku, Komamura, Suí-Fēng, Byakuya and Yamamoto's pages? --Ginhikari (talk) 06:38, May 20, 2013 (UTC)

Personality
"Unohana is a soft-spoken, polite, and caring woman who uses honorifics when addressing everyone, including her subordinates and the enemy." Can we add that Isane is exception since she never uses honorifics with her, but simply calls her Isane? Example: Bleach manga; Chapter 380, pages 15-16 Night486 (talk) 23:06, July 5, 2013 (UTC)

Past tense
In the introduction past tense is used, and I understand that it is because she's dead. But in articles such as Ulquiorra's and Nnoitra's, present tense is used even though they're dead. What should be used in the introductions of articles about deceased characters? --Ginhikari (talk) 18:48, September 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * It should be present tense. 18:57, September 14, 2013 (UTC)

Then I'll go ahead and change it in Unohana's page. There seems to be the same thing on Yamamotos page, should it be changed there too? --Ginhikari (talk) 19:14, September 14, 2013 (UTC)
 * All intro sections should be in present tense. Only the history sections should be in past.


 * Actually Xil brought this up to me previously and I said it was acceptable for the intro to be past tense. Fact is if she is dead it makes no sense to state she has a position a dead person cannot fill. Xil brought up the point that other pages didnt have that, but I also pointed out that no other group has a established organization that still is any real form of existence. Further conversation would need to be had but that the general reasoning behind that change.--

Sorry to open this up again, but on Chōjiro's and Kaien's pages it says that they are former lieutenants, those pages don't use past tense. I think we should either change the intros on the Chōjiro's and Kaien's pages or the intros on Retsu's and Yamamoto's pages to match the other, to keep the consistency on the wiki. What do you think? --Ginhikari (talk) 15:31, September 25, 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes. that change should be made.--

Title Section - Incorrect
Wrong/Incorrect Information on the "Titles" Section.

In the Titles section on Retsu Unohana's page, it says Kenpachi Zaraki was the next Kenpachi after Retsu was.

There are 9 other Kenpachi's in between Retsu and Zaraki, including Kiganjō.

In my opinion, if you are going to still have the "Titles" table, Kiganjō should be listed as the Kenpachi after Retsu, considering he held the title before Zaraki and we don't know any of the other Kenpachis.

Smac919 (talk) 01:57, February 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * Fixed.--

Shunpo Skills
I think her skill in shunpo should be looked over again.Her page only sates that she can keep up with the average captain,when Sajin's page had this he was only an Practitioner. Naruto 45 (talk) 22:49, February 25, 2014 (UTC)


 * Maybe a oversight it should be fixed accordingly.--


 * So can I changed it ? Naruto 45 (talk) 02:40, February 28, 2014 (UTC)


 * Yep.--

Unohana's Bankai's Special Ability
I see it is still listed as unknown but I thought it was made clear that the liquid substance from her Bankai caused the victims skin and body to disolve/melt/erode away. The reason Kenpachi kept regaining his skin is because she was healing him, mentioning she would "kill" him over and over again and then heal him. Let me know what you all think, and if one of you would be mind filling in the details of it on her page. Reeves92 (talk) 07:29, February 26, 2014 (UTC)


 * Thats not something anyone came up with, while its a seemingly interesting and possible situation. The issue there is healing doesnt work that fast, healing kido is a considerable time consuming process and in that particular situation it was the last point of their altercation. Thus it didnt seem to work the way your pointing out. The whole situation was a little inconsistent and empty on the explanation department even by visual analysis so thats why we really didn't have a logical explanation. It was safer to put nothing then speculate with something we werent sure of. --

is Unohana listed as deceased or Unknown for now
so Unahana listed as deceased for now or i heard some people say she was listed as unknown for now and i didn't see anything of her being listed as deceased on her info page--Prince of zahard (talk) 19:21, March 13, 2014 (UTC)


 * She is listed as deceased, nowhere is it said among staff her being unknown on here.--

Bankai's liquid
I've been wondering about this for a while, but is it safe to say that the liquid that forms her bankai is blood? Since it is red and thick, and does have the appearance to the blood we see so much being splashed throughout the battlefield. Yatanogarasu (talk) 02:17, June 4, 2014 (UTC)


 * I'm not so sure it is. I mean, you're correct in that it does RESEMBLE blood a lot, but for all we know it could be a thick, viscous, dark-colored acid of some sort, since there was that whole page of melting skin and stuff. I apologize for beating a dead horse reason-wise, but I don't think we can confirm what it is until we learn what, exactly, her Bankai does.--Xilinoc (talk) 02:32, June 4, 2014 (UTC)


 * I guess so. Just thought I brought this to light and sort it all out. Yatanogarasu (talk) 03:18, June 4, 2014 (UTC)


 * Not a problem at all, the whole situation is just really confusing to everyone.--Xilinoc (talk) 05:18, June 4, 2014 (UTC)

8000 sword schools?
In the Swordsmanship piece it speaks of her knowing all 8,000 of the world's schools of swordsmanship. However, the reference to where it points, the (fan based) translation I use, speaks of her knowing all sword schools, and calling herself Yachiru.

While 'Yachi' (八千) indeed can mean 8000, it also means many/much/... (for example, 八千草 yachikusa means a variaty of herbs (opposite to it's literal meaning of 8000 herbs) and 八千代 yachiyo means eternity (opposite to its literal meaning of 8000 generations).

If there is no other confirmation she can do 8000 styles, wouldn't it be much more realistic that the non-literal meaning is intended? As in, she knows "all of the world's schools", not "all 8,000 of the world's schools" Qube0 (talk) 13:47, August 1, 2014 (UTC)


 * Hm. Looking back at Cnet128's translation at the chapter, Shunsui indeed mentions that she is a master of "countless" sword styles. Which agrees with one of the possible translations of "Yachiru" that our own Translation Corner provided. Mohrpheus   (Talk)  19:45, August 1, 2014 (UTC)