Forum:Tia Harribel

Well I've been thinking that it's a tad odd that in the current matchups we've seen Barragan and then Starrk fight, while Harribel is still to be seen against the vizards. In the previous Gotei - arrancar fights, it went in order of power, so fraccion vs vice-captains, then third espada, second and primera. This time around, when clearly it's for real as shown by the death of Barragan and the near death of Starrk (perhaps), we've skipped the Tres and gone straight to the top two. Showing the weaker fights first to build up to the stronger ones is a popular story telling mechanism and Kubo has followed it almost religiously so far, 9th espada died first, admittedly 6th was defeated next but other then that it has been in numerical order. Which leads me to believe that Harribel has something up her rather small sleeves because otherwise it wouldn't be very entertaining to have the top two killed and then go back to the third and she's just the third still. There's no fun in that.

So what I thought about was the aspects of death that the espada each represent. Funnily enough they haven't really had much influence on anything excpet the espada's personalities up until the top few, Barragan is obvious, and Starrk's power to split himself into seperate bodies to stave off loneliness was an interesting twist. Sacrifice. Maybe, and this is obviously just speculation, but maybe with every death of her compadre's, Harribel gains power. She did attack more ferociously when her Fraccion died, and obviously that was partly due to affection, but maybe there was something to do with their power flowing into her. Anyway, something like that would spice up her fight and ensure that once Starrk bit the dust there was still some point to her duel. BollyW 00:11, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

Yea,I was thinking of that too.. and i wondered something:What if Aizen planned this?What if he wanted the first 2 espada to die or get brutaly injured and like Barragan used her aspect of death as the advantage as in something along the lines of Sacrificing herself, to ressurect all the other espada? or sacrificing her body for all the other espada to take control over after the grave?or i can be juat a big loonie.

As long as it doesn't bring Barragan back to life I'll be happy. I was more thinking of just gaining raw power but I'm sure there's heaps of ways it could go down... BollyW 00:57, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

I call explosion! She goes all H-bomb and explodes! Tinni 01:47, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

Maybe everyone is looking way to deep into this. With all the other aspects the Espada showed them in their personality. The aspects weren't really represented as abilities until you look at Starrk with his loneliness allows him to split his soul into countless wolves. Then theres yammy who increases his power with rage and Barragan with the whole time manipulation because of his old age aspect. The problem that sacrifice isn't some tangible ability really i mean its an action but nothing someone can actively fight with. she can sacrifice herself on behalf of another which would make it a personality thing like the vast majority of espada, also nothing about her powers which are obviously elemental (water) depict or insinuate any connection to another power. She is more then likely just selfless or willing to take a short term loss for a greater gain. Maybe her faccions deaths allowed her to be the greater gain, as in a chess match. So either its a personality issue or its already taken place and we didn't notice. If she truly believes in Aizen and is devoted to him she will sacrifice herself to save him from a killing blow or something or give her life for him in some way, assuming she is that devoted we havent seen that really. The only reason I can think of is that this battle beside Hitsugaya's involvement will be a girl fight and they wanna keep the urgency up cause it has more tension then just a issue of power, girls rarely fight each other, especially in bleach. Each espada battle (resulting in death) so far are men against men except for the rukia vs aaronaerio battle. I don't think its about following his usual mechanism of weaker to stronger. Its about balance at this point showing the strength of girls in a serious to the death fight. It was saved for last cause we have never seen the likes of it yet in bleach.Salubri 18:19, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

You could well be right and that it is purely because it's a high level female fight, but you agree with my point that the aspects of death has only really applied to the espada that were still alive after Barragan first mentioned it, possibly because Kubo didn't think up the idea until then. So in that case Harribel could have some sort of sacrifice related power. But yeh I was really just speculating and your explanation is at least as feasible as mine :P BollyW 23:10, September 19, 2009 (UTC)

I totally agree with Salubri here. Except for Rukia, who is one of the main cast and gets a lot of screen time, the other females are too weak to give us a good show. Hinamori, Isane, her little sister.. even Matsumoto. Without her breasts to flash every couple of secs, she's pretty much just for comic relief. Yoruichi is cool but doesn't do much fighting. Same with Unohana. Soi Fon is cool but her fight was against a fraccion and then she struggled against Barragan. Halibel vs Lisa and Hiyori will be a chick fight with epic proportions... Deimonos 01:20, 20 September 2009 (UTC)

Well the aspects of death can still be seen even before they were introduced. This is how everyone died: 9th drowned in his own GREED 8th got hit by the super drug, which caused him several hundred years of MADNESS before he died 7th had smoke come out of him when he died, which is like INTOXICATION 5th died from his fear﻿ of DESPAIR (being looked down upon by others) 4th faded away from EXISTENCE (nihilism) 2nd got killed from his own rotting spell, which aged him to his death.Codyage 02:38, September 20, 2009 (UTC)

A point of clarification: it didn't actually take Szayel hundreds of years to die, it merely felt like hundreds of years to him. Twocents 03:27, September 20, 2009 (UTC)

There is a bit of confusion i think. 9th was killed when Rukia shattered his cylinder it had nothing to do with his aspect (which was more of a reflection on his hollow absorption ability and personality). 8th was mad to suffer for turning mayuri's zanpakuto against him, the madness aspect has more to do with his personality as a immoral scientist. 7th died by byakuya's hands and once again the aspect seems somewhat out of place as its not displayed in his powers or in his personality (unless you count his devotion to aizen as being intoxicated to his message or something). 6th in his personality there was the aspect of destruction and he used his abilities to cause alot of it. 5th is despair and thats the loss of hope which again hasnt been seen really in his personality or powers, but being looked down upon by others wouldnt fit. 4th is nihilism is despair and it amounts to nothing so ulquirra's personality probably fits the bill. 2nd is easy barragan had old age (time) and in using it as an ability in the end it killed him. 1st loneliness well stark has the personality and and its reflected somewhat in his powers.Salubri 03:49, September 20, 2009 (UTC)\


 * I think with 5th it had more to do with his own outlook on life, Nnoitra's seemed pretty depressed with wanting to die and not believing hollows could be saved, and from his "you can't cut me" thing. Hey Nnoitra's Hiorre nearly reduced Kenpachi to despair when Kenpachi started to believe that Nnoitra cannot be cut. It's only when Kenpachi started to be able to cut him that Kenpachi got back into the fight. With 7th it was more to do with the nature of his power I think. Plus Amor = love = addictive :-) So yes the aspect of death is a combination of their personality and powers. Tinni 05:45, September 20, 2009 (UTC)

-the other females are too weak to give us a good show. Hinamori, Isane, her little sister.. even Matsumoto.- Matsumoto did beat Isuzu and she and Momo were doing fine against the fraccion until Allon showed up. As long as they stick to weaker enemies, the female lieutenants can do fine. If you're just talking about vs captain classes though... yea, pretty much just Soi Fon and Yoruichi (who needs to fight more!) and sorta Rukia can give good showings. Oh yea, and Nel! ZeroSD 11:38, September 21, 2009 (UTC)


 * Firstly zero, you forgot Unohana, who according to her stats is strongest chapter behind Aizen and Yamamoto. Even Aizen ran from her ^.^ Also, I feel that Rukia get's over-hyped because of her defeat of espada no. 9. I do not believe she is all that strong and I am fairly certain both Matsumoto and Hinamori are stronger then her. She defeated no. 9 with a surprise attack and no. 9 was the only gillian class espada. I don't actually think she would last all that long in a one on one battle against either Matsumoto or Hinamori. Especially Hinamori who seems to have a fire-type zanpakuto and is tons better at kido then her. But of course we'll never know that for sure. Tinni 14:50, September 21, 2009 (UTC)

If I can get back to Harribel, maybe that 'sacrafice' power, if it even exists, is kind of like a 'last stand' power; immense power, possibly a match for Aizen's, but it's short lived, and after it, she's completely screwed.

Kind of same vein as Tinni's H-bomb idea, albeit less drastic. TomServo101 12:05, September 21, 2009 (UTC)

I am sorry, this is really cruel. Especially to Harribel fans but I must say that I approve of the turn of events for Harribel. Ever since that freeze-melt-freeze-melt fight with Hitsugaya I decided that Harribel is THE most boring espada and that she's not too bright either, given all those bloody lectures she was giving Hitsugaya. It was painfully clear that she had no comprehension of what a Gotei 13 captain was, when she wanted to challenge Yama-jii... that was just... the height of delusion doesn't begin to describe it. So I feel vindicated in my opinion of her, given that it seem Aizen agrees with me! But is she dead? That I won't call till I see her rotting corpse. But this was an unique way to live upto her aspect of death. Tinni 13:39, September 25, 2009 (UTC)

At Tinni: I agree with you that she isn't one of the most interesting Espadas, but I think Yammy would be the most boring.

He's a complete idiot, no common sense, and a release that just makes him look like he wants to be Godzilla. True, even thinking of killing Yamamoto is completely insane for her...But Yammy is the Espada, who after being bested by Ichigo attacked the more powerful Urahara and Yoruichi without any sort of plan. And Urahara again, even after he had seen how how strong he was.

Alright, on the topic of Harribel's status. I think some of you are overestimating Aizen's attack...I doubt she's that close to death at the moment. And what I'm wondering, is what Aizen is thinking? If she's useless to him, just let her keep some of his enemies busy.

And, I like BollyW's idea of her getting stronger with each ally that dies....What would be even more interesting, would be if she GAINED the power of each ally that dies near her.