Forum:Espada (General discussions)

This forum is for discussing topics about the Espada in general. For specific characters, see their individual forum. 11:04, December 22, 2010 (UTC)

Aspects of Death

 * Starrk Coyote - Loneliness: Reflective of his ability to become a hollow with heart. He already wanted to become weak because everyone is with him. They split their body just to make Starrk not lonely with Lilyneth.
 * Barragan Luisenbarn - Aging (Time): Reflective of his ability to "age" his opponent, a form of time manipulation.
 * Tia Harribel - Sacrifice: Reflective of her willingness to fight for her Fraccion.
 * Ulquiorra Cifer - Nihilism: Reflective of his nihilistic view on life. Can be clearly seen in his attempts to rationalize the "heart" Orihime spoke of in a way he could comprehend.
 * Nnoitra Jiruga - Despair: Reflective of both his personality and fighting style. In the former, it can be seen as his anger of being looked down upon by a superior in his past. In the latter, it can be seen in his sadistic usage of mental and physical torture that he deals to his opponents and their allies.
 * Grimmjow Jaegerjaquez - Destruction: Reflective of his destructive nature in and out of combat. Many of his abilities are also highly destructive in nature.
 * Zommari Leroux - Intoxication: Reflective of his resurrección ability to gain control of his opponent, which results in him indulging in the false belief that nothing is superior to his power. This can be seen in his fight with Byakuya Kuchiki.
 * Szayel Aporro Granz - Madness: Reflective of his psychotic personality and his fighting style, which involves throwing his opponent into a sense of "madness".
 * Aaroniero Arruruerie - Greed: Reflective of both his ability to consume other hollow's powers and his greedy personality.
 * Yammy Rialgo - Rage: Reflective of his headstrong nature and inability to control his anger.

Stark and loneliness
Stark's characteristics for loneliness are listed as "unknown at this time." We now know that Lilynette is part of Stark's Resureccion. The fact that his soul and power are split into two and that he can only fight at full strength with Lilynette probably has to do with his role as the "loneliness" component. QuoteRadar 19:40, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Espada Death Representation Typo
it occured to me, after reading Bleach 356, that Ulquiorra's aspect of death doesnt really apply. Nihilism is the total rejection of established law and institutions. i thought 'that sounds more like Nnoitra.' but then, i look at Nnoitras aspect of death, which is despair. doesnt despair fit ulquiorra? he freaking looks like he is crying all the time, and his Segunda Etapa is called "True Despair"... see the connection? Nihilism is Nnoitra exactly. I think they got mixed up.--Ulquiorra Wannabe128 11:10, 11 May 2009 (UTC)


 * you may be correct in your assumption, but the writer out it as it is and that is how it is
 * and Nihilism is not rejection of law and institutions, but rather a view on life consisting
 * of that if life has no meaning it is not worth living(hence him always asking about the heart)
 * Fawcettp 11:33, 11 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Also to add on to Fawcettp's statement, that would fit Uliqiorra fairly well. Nnoitra is likely despair because he hates loosing, every time anyone beats him he wants them to kill him because they have destroyed his pride. (When he had lost to Kenpach, Kenny was gonna let him live but he just about forced Kenny to kill him.)Acacia Akiyama 20:22, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Remains of the Espada
This is something I've noticed. For some of the Espada, when they die their bodies disintegrate, while for others, their bodies just stay there. Can someone tell me what happened to the bodies of each of the Espada when they died? I'd like to know because of something that I have in mind. State whether their bodies stayed solid, disintegrated, or unknown. I'm trying to rule out the possibilities of certain Espada returning, in case this way seem like a weird question.

O for the love of... I am going to stop you right there and say NONE Of the Espada are returning (with the possible exception of Grimmjow, but even he is supposedly confirmed dead by Kubo in a recent interview). Any theory you come-up with based on disintegration or non-disintegrating would be considered a crack theory per our Bleach Wiki:Speculation Policy and not something you can air here. We are not going to become a source of Bleach crack! Tinni  (Talk)  02:07, December 22, 2010 (UTC)

I never said I'd post my theory. I just want to know for personal reasons.

Confusion
I was origionally confused by some of the Espada rankings. First, how was Grimmjow origionally able to defeat Ulquiorra(even if Ulquiorra wasn't being serious:come on)? Then, how was Grimmjow able to defeat Luppi so easily when they were supposed to be on equal level? While this could also be explained by the fact that Luppi had just exhausted quite a lot of power against Hitsugaya while Grimmjow was running hot), my theory is this: I think that Espada are ranked not based on any sort of special abilties, but by the sheer amount of reiryoku they possess. Also, in each Arrancar, I think that certain ammounts of their collective reiryoku is set aside for certain abilities. For example, I think that Grimmjow had the majority of his reiryoku placed in his Sonido, Strength, and Cero capabilities. In other words, offensive, destructive abilities that naturally fit his personality. However, this made his Hierro rather lacking. Ulquiorra, on the other hand, has more reiryoku than Grimmjow, but his offensive/defensive abiltities ratio is more evened out. Which leads to another thing; Yammy Rialgo's released state. While I dont doubt that he is now the strongest Espada in terms of reiryoku levels, the guy is huge. His mobility has take a huge hit, which, going by my theory, will make him nigh impossible to damage with all that power juicing up his Hierro. --Ulquiorra Wannabe128 23:56, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

I'll attempt to respond to your questions from the way I perceive things, anyway. Twocents 00:11, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * 1) Grimmjow didn't really beat Ulquiorra. All he did was temporarily trap him in another dimension. I don't really view that as a defeat.
 * 2) Honestly, I think Aizen put Luppi there just to annoy Grimmjow. Because, if Luppi was actually powerful enough to be the Sexta Espada, then he should have been the Septima Espada before then.
 * 3) I can understand your theory, but I think abilities and the use of those abilities make one person more powerful than another. Just because someone may have more reiryoku or technical combat prowess doesn't necessarily mean they'd be capable of defeating someone who's supposed to be at a lower level than them. An example that first comes to mind is Tosen vs. Kenpachi.
 * 4) As we haven't seen Yammy even do anything, it's a bit presumptuous to make unfounded, relatively random assumptions about his Resurrección.

I agree. Luppi was too annoying to be an Espada, so Aizen must have just thought, what the hell, this'll piss Grimmjow off.

Strongest
Does anyone other than me think that Wonderweiss might be the strongest arrancar in Aizens army? It would be just like Aizen, too, keeping his stongest arrancar separate from the espada. My evidence is mainly circumstansive, so bear with me; Now it can be safely assumed that Ukitake and Kyoraku are on the same level when it comes to Shunpo and reflexes, right? so how was it that Wonderweiss, unreleased, could sonido to get behind Ukitake when Ukitake had his full attention on him, but Starrk is incapable of performing that same feat against Kyoraku in his Unreleased state, and he is the Primera?--Ulquiorra Wannabe128 00:04, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

I think the answer to that is relatively simple - their attention was distracted by Fura. Ukitake wasn't paying attention to Wonderweiss. It's a lot easier to sneak up on someone who isn't even paying any attention to you. And maybe he does possess a lot of power, but the way he uses that power in battle situations seems to imply that he's immature and not a particularly fearsome or capable opponent. Twocents 00:11, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

I also think wonderwiess maybe powerful, though how much powerful is not known by partially hinted at. As far as what happened at his arrival that doesn't seem to verify anything for me personally. Ukitake and Shunsui are two of the most powerful captains ever and the likelihood that they are easily dispatched doesn't click well with what we know. After all we find that being hit by a point blank cero in his back from a released starrk isn't enough to even really deal so much as a scratch to Shunsui. Also we don't know what Wonderweiss used it doesn't really show his movement besides having him in one place and then another but nothing about how he got where he was. Alot about him doesn't really confirm anything in terms of his power compared to the others. Salubri 00:18, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

The Espada's friends
With Lilynette's comment in the latest chapter - about Starrk fighting to protect his friends - who do you suppose those are? And, to take it a step further, who do you suppose each of the Espada (former or current) would consider to be their friends?

Personally, I'm finding it interesting that Tite is making them a bit more human, in a way, so I figured I'd see what others thought before adding in my own opinion. Twocents 20:57, September 4, 2009 (UTC)

Starrk could have friends in surprising places. He is immensely powerful but his easy-going and relaxed mannerisms make him more approachable by Espada and Arrancar of lower rank than any of his authoritarian compatriots.

Starrk also seems to view the Aizen's arrancor army not only as a place to pursue his own agenda but as a community with people he knows and likes. Even if Starrk doesn't personally like a particular arrancor he will be institutionally loyal to them (comrades-in-arms). That attitude would sit well with arrancor like Harribel, for example.

Just because some arrancor view the arrancor army as simply an expedient and expendable road to personal power (I'm looking at you Barragan) doesn't mean that all arrancor are so casual and careless about it. Great Cthulhu 13:00, September 6, 2009 (UTC)

Espada Tattoos
I have a theory about the Espada tattoos. I think they are directly related to the Espadas' spiritual power. Kind of obvious but it explains the following:

1. Nnoitra's tattoo changes from 8 to 5. 2. Yammy's tattoo changes when he transforms. 3. Ulquiorra's tattoo disappears when he transforms to Segunda Etapa.

I believe that this is because their reiatsu becomes so singular that the tattoos no longer applies, like trying to convert inches while using a centimeter conversion. --Ulquiorra Wannabe128 18:19, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Please use proper capitals and grammar for better understanding. By the way I agree with your point. And also I think Ulquiorra "evolves" than "transforms" to Segunda Etapa mode. Yammy releases his Resurreccion, no transform.--Kroduz 19:40, 19 April 2009 (UTC)