Talk:Gin Ichimaru

Shikai Length
I can't add this but figure someone might want to. The average wakizashi's (essentially Gin's sword) blade length is 2 feet. If Gin's shikai can extend 100 times his blade's original length than it can extend up to a maximum of 200 ft. Someone might want to add that in there so that readers can get a clearer description of how long his Shikai actually is. Heart of the Force 06:44, August 23, 2010 (UTC)


 * But is Gin's Zanpakuto the same length as the average wakizashi? We cannot say that it is, so it would be speculation. And we do not allow speculation on the articles. 10:15, August 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * I understand and it's up to you guys whether you want to change it or not, doesn't really matter. But as an avid sword collector, martial artist, and kendo practitioner - trust me. If it is never stated by TK himself, Gin's sword is, proportionally based on the other swords around him as well as his own height, a wakizashi. Heart of the Force 15:21, August 26, 2010 (UTC)
 * I understand and it's up to you guys whether you want to change it or not, doesn't really matter. But as an avid sword collector, martial artist, and kendo practitioner - trust me. If it is never stated by TK himself, Gin's sword is, proportionally based on the other swords around him as well as his own height, a wakizashi. Heart of the Force 15:21, August 26, 2010 (UTC)

Kido
The section on Gin's Kido skill states that he used Hakufuku to hide Rangiku's reiatsu. This does not seem to be the case however, considering that Hakufuku is only known to knock a target unconcious. Wouldn't this indicate that Gin hid her reiatsu with a barrier similar to that of Isshin's on Ichigo's and his?. Zira1 (talk) 08:10, August 29, 2010 (UTC)

Rangiku said Gin used Hakufuku upon waking up from its effects. Saying that Gin used any kind of barrier would be speculation. Besides, Rangiku would've noticed a barrier if it had been there. Lia Schiffer  (Talk)  08:21, August 29, 2010 (UTC)

Given Gin's state when she woke up, wouldn't a barrier stemming from his reiatsu have vanished? Zira1 (talk) 08:33, August 29, 2010 (UTC)

It's not our place to guess or speculate about barriers that we don't know whether they were placed in the first place. All that we know is that he used Hakufuku, we're not going to make up things based on "maybe"'s and guessings. Lia Schiffer  (Talk)  08:42, August 29, 2010 (UTC)

So, it's better to attach unconfirmed abilities to Hakufuku, considering that it was previously only mentioned as able to knock a person out? Zira1 (talk) 18:12, August 29, 2010 (UTC)

It maybe the abilities of the spell weren't clear in the first place. Its reasonable to believe that Hakufuku is able to make a person pass out due to suppressing their reiatsu or something. Similar to how reiatsu acts when a high level character uses it against a lower level one. Then in turn it has the side effect of masking the affected spiritual power. The issue I think is we dont have a clear definition of that spells capabilities.--Salubri (Talk)  18:18, August 29, 2010 (UTC)


 * It would be less speculative to simply say that he used Hakufuku to knock her out and either Hakufuku or another ability to hide her reiatsu. Bastian964 01:47, September 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * No, it would not. The fact is that Gin hid her reiatsu and upon waking up from being unconscious, Rangiku says Hakufuku. To say that any other ability was used to achieve one of the effects is speculative--God (Pray)  01:52, September 19, 2010 (UTC)
 * That's why I said either Hakufuku or another ability, instead of just another ability. Anyways, saying that Hakufuku can hide reiatsu or that Matsumoto even knew her reiatsu was hidden is speculation itself since all she said was "This feeling... Hakufuku...". Since speculation isn't allowed the only way to get around this is to mention that he used Hakufuku on her without mentioning any effects it might or might not have.Bastian964 02:20, September 19, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, no! Hakufuku was the only spell that was mentioned and that's it! So all things that happened, reiatsu concealment and her being knocked unconsciousness everything, must be attributed to Hakufuku. There is no evidence to suggest Hakufuku can't conceal reiatsu. Nothing in the manga, databook or anything contradicts that reading of events. Saying "Hakufuku or another ability" implies that another ability might have been involved. We can't do that. We have to take the option dictated by Occam's razor. We know Rangiku was knocked unconscious. We know that Aizen couldn't dictate Rangiku's reiatsu. When Rangiku woke-up she only commented on the Hakufuku spell being cast on her. Therefore, the simplest explanation is that Hakufuku did both. Going a little meta, Kubo never said Hakufuku did not conceal reiatsu. Therefore, there is no reason to suppose he didn't extend the definition of that particular kido to include reiatsu concealment. He can extend spell abilities, or rather, he can reveal more about spells that are his invention. So unless something that can be cited that says Hakufuku can only knock a Shinigami unconscious, then as of chapter 416, Hakufuku has been shown to both knock a target unconscious and hide their reiatsu. Closing discussion as I can't imagine what is left unsaid on this topic. Tinni  (Talk)  02:44, September 19, 2010 (UTC)