Talk:Quincy: Vollständig

Mistake
The vollstandig does not give a Quincy their Blut abilities...at best one could say they are enhanced by it but even so...can someone fix this? Darksusanoo (talk) 03:08, July 8, 2012 (UTC)

Origin of the names
I think I found out how Kubo gave name to each Vollstandig. Each one ends in "iel", the same ending to every name of the Archangels of the Eastern Orthodox. He also attributed a name like "Walk of God" or "Justice of God", like the Archangels have.

Here's the list of the Archangels to understand this better:
 * Michael in the Hebrew language means "Who is like unto God?" or "Who is equal to God?"
 * Gabriel means "Man of God" or "Might of God."
 * Raphael means "God's healing" or "God the Healer"
 * Uriel means "Fire of God," or "Light of God"
 * Sealtiel means "Intercessor of God"
 * Jegudiel means "Glorifier of God."
 * Barachiel means "Blessing of God."
 * Jerahmeel means "God's exaltation."

However, this might be mere speculation, but it should have place in Trivia, I think. -- (preceding unsigned comment by User:Davidchola2)


 * First sign your posts. Secondly This is speculation and has no place in trivia anymore then it does in the rest of the article. Trivia cant be what ifs and maybe's and it cannot be common generalizations. It has to be verified information. --


 * Actually, that wouldn't be speculation, that'd be fact. No other tradition/religion uses that type of generalized naming, except Abrahamic religions. The Vollstandig are named in a style after the way the Hebrew angels are named. For example, in Hebrew, Biskiel would be "God is My Justice" and Grimaniel is "God is My Path". "-iel" is used to note ownership to God, and the first part of the word is used to denote what is God's. This is not speculation at all, its just common knowledge. Its a motif. Just like Kubo didn't come out and say his Quincy used a German motif, or Arrancar Spanish; it was a given, given that they used Spanish and German words respectively.  ~ ~ Ten Tailed Fox   < t al k > 05:14, July 2, 2013 (UTC)


 * This is very much correct. is the origin of the Abrahamic God and has remained in the names of God to this day.  KawaTsuyo  (Talk) 23:04, January 24, 2014 (UTC)

Types
The section that lists the various Vollständig names includes Grimaniel, though his wielder's name is left blank despite him having an article. Even though he is not properly named, I think there should be a link to his page. However, the article is currently locked, so I'm hoping an administrator can add the Unnamed Male Vandenreich's name to the page.

Grimaniel
Is Grimaniel really considered a various of Vollstandig? It may look like a Vollstandig but I don't think it doesn't qualify because it is a type of attack which may appear as such.--CNBA3 (talk) 04:41, November 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * This one's a tricky subject. The Quincy who owns "Grimaniel" never actually said the words "Quincy: Vollstandig", but at best (someone else would have to explain this better than I), it's being called Vollstandig at the moment since it seems to hold the same naming convention as Quilge's. In the next few chapters we may get a better idea of Vollstandig names, so all I can say is that we all just have to be patient.
 * Really now? Well, considering that it 1. has a similar name and meaning to Piskiel (both end in "iel", the kanji of both are "[noun] of God") and 2. did not provide an effect that was completely different from Commander Gordon's usual attack (he fired a bullet), I'm inclined to disagree with you. All signs point to it being a variant of Quincy: Vollständig, and you've provided no evidence of it being anything else (CNBA3, that is).--Xilinoc (talk) 05:01, November 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * Also, the guy appears to have had wings and a Wanden-Halo. That's very typical of people using the Quincy: Vollständig.
 * Then wouldn't it be simpler to just say Quincy: Vollstandig?--CNBA3 (talk) 13:38, November 12, 2013 (UTC)
 * No, as the Sternritter specifically used "Grimaniel" as the name of a technique.


 * I have to agree. It is definitely his Vollstandig. Though we don't acknowledge it on the page, the Quincy's Vollstandig, thus far, are named after angels (both Grimaniel and Biskiel are angels). The "-iel" is the Hebrew way of inserting "of God" into the names of people, but mostly angels. Other than that, it has the appearance of a Vollstandig — the Reishi wings and Reishi halo.  ~ ~ Ten Tailed Fox   < <font color="#800080">t <font color="#800080">al <font color="#800080">k <font color="#800080">> 19:42, November 12, 2013 (UTC)

Volstandig doesnt remove a Quincies power?
Is it worth noting that several quincy have used Volstandig and not lost their powers, such as Cang (still using the iron) and Unnamed Male Sternritter 1 using Grimaniel and still using his powers? Skitzo1 (talk) 18:56, December 9, 2013 (UTC)

Wasn't that kind of obvious? The Vollstanding is the answer to the drawbacks of the Letzt Stil. Thus besides of providing anything Letzt Stil does and more,it does not remove the powers of a Quincy. I honestly thought this was common knowledge. Hmm,I don't know should that now be drawn out on the wiki FinestFantasyVI (talk) 19:45, December 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * Quilge himself stated that the Quincy: Letzt Stil is considered outdated because using it causes a loss of Quincy powers, whereas Quincy: Vollständig doesn't. Given how none of the Sternritter who have used this technique thus far have even mentioned the possibility of losing their powers thereafter, I'd think any reader could infer that it doesn't cause power loss even if they don't remember Quilge saying so.--Xilinoc (talk) 22:56, December 9, 2013 (UTC)
 * It is worth adding to the article, though, because the wording as it is is not very clear and uses direct calques of the manga's wording. The fact that Vollstandig doesn't cost the quincy his powers is much more informative and noteworthy than it "being completely different from Letzt Stil", as the article holds now. Xfing (talk) 13:29, October 29, 2014 (UTC)

More to be added
We only have 2 of the Vollständig listed thus far, although we've seen Cang Du, Bambietta Basterbine, and Mask De Masculine use theirs as well. KawaTsuyo (Talk) 23:14, January 24, 2014 (UTC)

What if Vollstandigs don't really have names?
But Biskiel, Grimaniel and Tatar Foras are just techniques that are available to Quincies only in their Vollstandig mode. Will-O-Wisp (talk)
 * To be honest, I'm kind of starting to ascribe to this theory as well, although in the case of Tatar Foras Äs makes it clear it's an ability.--Xilinoc (talk) 07:20, February 12, 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, in Quilge's case, his wording from Cnet's translation makes it pretty clear that he's referring to his Vollstandig itself as "Biskiel." As for Revolver Ocelot, he transformed only briefly and did nothing more than shoot Shunsui in the face - hardly something that could be ascribed to a "technique." "Tatar Foras" is an odd one, but two names don't exactly make for a solid pattern in the first place. Mohrpheus   (Talk)  00:35, February 13, 2014 (UTC)

What about Pepe Waccabrada's Gudoero? He called it that when he transformed during his battle with Byakuya. Are you all sure the Vollständigs don't have names? Poweltav (talk) 15:55, April 18, 2015 (UTC)

Update
this page could use some more editing there are a lot of other vollstandig's revealed there's bambietta volstandig which specializes in reishi bombs Mask D Masxulines volstandig which uses star flashes and there's as nodts volstandig which uses eyes that induce fear--Prince of zahard (talk) 22:29, February 12, 2014 (UTC)
 * You know, you could edit it yourself rather than complain about it.

This requires more intel on weather or not Vollstandigs have names or not. My personal opinion. Based on intel.

After activiting Vollstandig they call a name.

What do they do next? Nothing new. No new techniques.

For Biskiel Quilge activited it then sped behind Ichigo. Then attacks Ichigo via a slash of his sword. Which he was using before just not has fast or powerful.

No new technique or anything there.

For the two panels we saw Grimaniel. He used it and shot Shisui. He was shooting before.

So no new techniques or anything there.

For crazy bomber babe she was using bombs before. Just not has many at once.

No new techniques. Just an enhanced version of how many she can produced at once. Well that statement depends on how many she could do before Vollidig which we never saw.

For Mask he activated it then flew up and used the Star Flash Super Nova. Which is a powerful version of what he blasted Rose with.

Tatar Foras appears to be both a power up and an enhanced form of As Nodt liquid fear but now it is done via the eyes.

It seems to me that is slightly varies from person to person. But I thank that they are the names. Maybe Tatar FOras is both a name and technique.

Edit thanks to my slow posting and Kamikaze839 for making a new section while posting my thoughts on the Volldig don't have names section. Now it looks like i posted in the wrong one. So huh yet deleting this is against the rules right so just thought i would say that. --Darkhunter-X (talk) 23:59, February 12, 2014 (UTC)

i attempted it already but i'm bad at editing boxes i can't even edit info boxes but boxes are my main problem boxes with intel on them i don't know how to edit can someone do it for me or at least tell me how to do it--Prince of zahard (talk) 01:02, February 13, 2014 (UTC)

Features
Is it okay to add like certain features to the Quincy: Vollständig? Like "the users possess Wing-like Reishi constructs and a star on their heads."--CNBA3 (talk) 22:30, April 3, 2014 (UTC)
 * As long as you can provide a reference, go ahead.

I think we should add how the members of the Schutzstaffel have practically the same, if not similar, Vollständig. They each have feathery wings, rather than default reishi wings other Sternritter have, except Äs Nodt and Mask de Masculine. It's probably because Lillie Barro, Askin Nakk Le Varr, Gerard Valkyrie, and Pernida Parnkgjas are the Sternritter elite guard and are probably stronger than most Sternritter. Poweltav (talk) 15:46, April 18, 2015 (UTC)

Are we sure?
Are we sure that this technique is activated by the sanrei glove because the only link that proves that is quilge opie's incident. That wasn't even him taking off a sanrei glove, he had a black glove underneath his standard uniform gloves with the Wandenreich symbol on it and activated it. Every other person that's used it was not seen using a glove, or anything sometimes, at that. Is this something we should look into? Riptide240 (talk) 13:29, June 15, 2014 (UTC)


 * Quilge stated that the Vollständig is the true form of the Letzt Still which is activated by the removal of the glove!! Now the article does list the exceptions to the case and things but yes removal of the Sanrei Glove or Sanrei Belt (etc) allows one to activate their Vollständig in the same capacity!! No doubt it is the same as the release command of Zanpakutō, sometiems people use it sometimes they don't!!


 * Allow me to clarify, just because the release commands aren't always used doesn't mean we should remove the referenced information from articles regarding them and its the same for this!!


 * Do we even know if that was a sanrei glove? And nobody really takes anything off, but they activate the symbol. So my point still stands. And, PS, Quilge also said that Letzt Stil and Vollstadig are like Heaven and Earth Riptide240 (talk) 23:31, June 15, 2014 (UTC)

Activation
I don't think that removing the glove is what happens to activate it. Mask didn't remove his belt, Cang Du nor BG9 removed any gloves, nor did Bambietta, Candice, Bazz-B, Liltotto, Meninas, and the Unnamed Male Sternritter. It seems to be that it's the emblem that triggers Vollstandig. SilverRain (talk) 04:49, July 8, 2014 (UTC)

Former Power(s)
Due to Auswahlen stealing the power of Quincy:Vollstandig from Bazz-B, Liltotto Lamperd, NaNaNa Najahkoop, and Robert Accutrone; and Bazz-B says they can't use it anymore, I suggest we list the Vollstandigs of the above Sternritter under Former Powers & Abilities. While at the same time adding the Former Powers & Abilities to their pages.Poweltav (talk) 22:27, June 23, 2015 (UTC)

Auswahlen and Vollstandig
When revived by Auswahlen, the SS gained wings, and in one panel, Gerard was seen with a halo. This led to this wiki associating their winged form as some sort of "false" Quincy: Vollstandig.

I suggest just dissociating their winged forms from Quincy: Vollstandig altogether. The wings are different (as mentioned in the article already), only Gerard is shown with a halo in a single panel, and their real Quincy: Vollstandigs look radically different.

As for Gerard, he's a weirdo. His Quincy: Vollstandig doesn't have have wings or a halo, and he gains a mask and tattoos like some sort of Arrancar or Visored. He's clearly an exception among exceptions. (WARNING: SPECULATION INCOMING.) Maybe since he's the Soul King's heart, he can naturally form a halo? Mimihagi has one. Lightning Laxus (talk) 21:33, February 24, 2020 (UTC)

Color Question
Hi All,

Quick question, as we all know the first 3 Strenritters who will appear on Bleach Brave Souls (And there Seiyuus), but as Darkmachines found out there are spoiler (https://www.reddit.com/r/BleachBraveSouls/comments/g7zflj/end_of_april_tybw_banner/) we have images of them in their Vollstandig in different colors. (Candice-Green, Askin-Purple, Bambietta-Pink)

So I was wondering if its OK to add in the Overview to add this new fact, or do we wait until the Anime is released next year and see if they add in there individual colors.

Also for the Variations Sections, do we add in a Color section like we do on the Cero page?

(CoolJazzman (talk) 07:37, April 26, 2020 (UTC))


 * I noticed too. Personally, I'd add the different colors under the trivia section for now, and wait until the anime comes back to see which ones they go with. Timjer (talk) 07:50, April 26, 2020 (UTC)

Cool Mate Thank You!! (CoolJazzman (talk) 08:10, April 26, 2020 (UTC))

Sklavrei Vollstandigs
The Vollstandigs that were empowered by Sklavrei should be changed to reflect their base form appearance rather than the Sklavrei enhancement version, just like the pages for Candice, Meninas, Liltotto, and Giselle were changed. Bob1200 (talk) 04:56, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Nah.--Xilinoc (talk) 08:46, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Why not? It makes more sense to actually align them with their pages and alter this one. Bob1200 (talk) 09:08, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * If we're taking the anime additions as canon, then these are meant to be the "true" forms of each Bambie's Vollstandig, giving them unique appearances and names in line with As, Robert, Quilge, etc. As such, we should depict the fullest form of them here, not the simplistic base form.--Xilinoc (talk) 19:35, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * I don't think the Sklavrei enhancement would be a true form, moreso an enhanced form. They likely gave the additional stuff to show that there was a visual change and not just abilities. Bob1200 (talk) 23:52, 11 September 2023 (UTC)
 * And yet, they only name their Vollstandig after enhancing them with Sklaverei, not in their base forms.--Xilinoc (talk) 06:36, 12 September 2023 (UTC)

they are their normal, base ones. Maybe add both? or make a separate tab for the enhanced ones.Edanakas (talk) 18:44, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Yeah...Gerard and Lille already have 2 forms for each, so the layout is already established. Bob1200 (talk) 23:52, 11 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Gerard and Lille's two forms are drastically different, whereas the Bambies' are just a couple additions to their wings and halos. That's not really enough to warrant a separate section.--Xilinoc (talk) 06:36, 12 September 2023 (UTC)