Forum:Where is TK heading?


 * 2 Vizards-captains (Love & Rose) allied against one espada (Stark).
 * A single Vizard-capt(Kensei) against WW.

Thinking of it I am wondering where TK is heading. We saw 2 Vizards-captains fighting a released Stark (#1) with shikais only (?), and now a Vizard-captain (Kensei) releasing his bankai (?) without reasons nor any shown hints about WW powers (what about his resurreccion). It's a kind of bizarre situation. Some captains go bankai for trivial fights but stay shikai for desperate ones. And actually we have an autistic opponent against a badass captain.

Not mentionning Aizen and co against a bunch of captains and vice captains of different levels (from Genryusai until Omaeda). Nor Shinji begging for Ichigo to save them (sounds like Orihime with her "Kurosaki kun")?! By times, Bleach goes from interesting to boring and vice versa. Of course it is full of surprises, but at the same time is full of nothing too. Espada #3 killed without showing her true potential (I am still searching where is her sacrifice idea), why Aizen waited so long (patience) and then finished her off (get bored). He plotted? If he wanted to finish the shinigami, first of all why not pairing his espadas. It could have been more interesting to see shinigamis true powers (Bankais and else) instead of proud arrogance or laziness. Remembering the past Kyoraku vs Stark fight, Shunsui did nothing against Stark one-on-one, but got in Rose+Love's fight to get Stark down. Until now, I saw hollows fighting face to face, but most of shinigamis generally sneaky and deceitful. I hope it is just an impression from my part.Baronofash 02:35, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

Who knows where he is going thats the point of reading. But there are alot of interesting things happening. But Shinji called for Ichigo because he went to save Orihime and he needs her to heal Hiyori they dont need ichigo to save them. Secondly The Espada where arrogant and there is no room to say the same of the shinigami im not sure what you were reading. Third we all saw Shunsui play with him and then own starrk one on one regardless of Rose and love jumping in, he was fighting Starrk first and just finished what he started, they were just mad cause they didnt get to. Shinigami arent sneaky and deceitful what are you talking about, what warped version are you reading cause i doubt you can name one time thats true. You do what you need to in order to win, the Espada arent honorable they wont play by the rules their powers see to that, besides that the only assassins on the field are Soifon and Omeada. You got the personality and tactics all wrong.Salubri 03:49, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

I see where you're coming from Baron, but I disagree. It's hardly Kyoraku's fault that Starrk failed to follow through and check that he was dead, and Starrk left himself open to be stabbed, it's a bit weird to expect Kyoraku warn him about something like that. Especially when the prize on the line is the existance of the whole world, I think anyone would take any opening or advantage they would get. The Espada have been just as bad if not worse than the Shinigami, consider Aaroneirro pretending to be Kaien, or Nnoitra picking on an exhausted and wounded Ichigo. As for the Kensei-WW thing, WW is almost certainly stronger then any of the Espada we've seen so far, as shown by Starrk stating that if WW was here, Aizen was sick of waiting. That means WW is the trump card, or more powerful than and of the Espada, and therefore Kensei is more than justified in using bankai. Love and Rose were almost certainly about to use bankai, if Kyoraku had not intervened. BollyW 06:00, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

To answer Salubri, well, Shinji called for Ichigo to have Orihime to save Hiyori, then why not calling for Orihime instead, after all, from where they are it would be hard to be heard, no? Thus, final scene we could see Ichigo going down of the tower...alone!
 * Shunsui, if I remember well, was playing the dead instead of fighting Stark head on, didn't he? Then referring to Love, he said that Shunsui never changed his habits to get into others fights. "In order to win, you have to do whatever is necessary to kill your enemy!", these are the words of Shunsui, and it means to use every options even the deceitful or the sneaky ones, because there are parts of the military tactics. This is not a question of good or right but remaining alive or dead. I never wrote that the espadas are honorable, I wrote that they fought face to face, didn't I. Espadas were too proud and arrogant concerning their powers that they didn't care to sneak between their opponents to fight them, except WW, don't you think. Kyoraku is one of my favorite characters because of his personality, he is impredictable and he does what is necessary to be done. Then, since I read Bleach in different languages, I would say that I read the original Japanese warped version as well as the English warped one, if you ask. If you read only the English one, then tell me who reads the warped version. Just to say, Bleach is a Japanese manga written by a Japanese writer, explaining by that that the characters presented have personalities in the Japanese conceptions. The Japanese and the Western conceptions are quite different, as some says.
 * 1 more point, as administrator you may be well inspired to not be arrogant against people who don't share your point of views.それでは・・・Baronofash 06:23, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

Excuse you the only one arrogant would be you placing personalities on people when you obviously know nothing about there traits and getting personal on those who call you out on instead of just admitting your wrong. in any language you spin it your interpretation of the characters are off you make it seem like the good guys are the bad guys for whatever reason. Calling them arrogant, sneaky and deceitful when the Espada only show those traits in personality not fighting, making negative remarks toward those who are the only ones standing against total destruction when its not warranted. Before you start typing know what your talking about.Salubri 06:41, October 12, 2009 (UTC)


 * Hey Salubri, Shunsui was playing the dead while fighting Starrk. :) Minato88 19:17, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

Whose fault is that Starrk thought he was powerful enough that his attack at point blank range was enough to take Shunsui out, he was only playing dead as far as lying there. We were all aware he was fine. Starrk himself didn't question whether he was alive or dead and was horribly wounded from the attack from behind they fought one on one in the end. It really has nothing to do with his personality as he didnt do anything underhanded. Shunsui is a awesome character but he is neither arrogant or deceitful. To call him such would be putting him on par with Aizen's personality.Salubri 20:18, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

I see your point, Baronfash but I suppose that's just the way Kensei rolls. He wants to bash WW hard and he's got no problem in using bankai early in a fight. I think that's just it.. Deimonos 20:55, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

I actually question the "playing dead" part. I mean, seriously. Kyoraku goes down in a blaze of cero -> Fura get's Aizen, Gin and Tosen out -> Kira starts screaming -> In comes the Vizards -> Shinji makes a comment to Aizen and then asks the others if they have anyone to want to say hi to and Lisa goes down to play with Kyoraku. All that took what two - three minutes max? Let say it took five minutes. Am I the only one who thinks that it would have taken Kyoraku about five minutes to recover from a point blank cero? I mean the way everybody keeps going on, you would think that cero did nothing to him, which doesn't say much about Starrk. But I am sure the cero did hurt him a little and so he was probably catching his breath. LISA accused him of playing dead (probably because he didn't jump-up and start groping her) but I doubt he was actually playing dead given the small amount of time that pass. He was probably just catching his breath and while he could have gotten straight up, things were starting to happen. Would any fighter worth his salt not take advantage of being out of sight and out of mind and observe the situation before making his move? As for the whole backstabbing thing. Clearly some point after the fight with Barragan, Kyoraku's sword started playing Kageoni. Starrk spends most of his time up in the air, so he didn't step on a shadow. The first time he did, Kyoraku struck. I doubt very much Kyoraku was trying to get Love and Rose to "wear" Starrk down. Honestly, Kyoraku fought like a veteran fighter and yes his philosophy is that what matters is the "mission". When you are charged with the protection of innocent lives it is a good philosophy to have. What, you expect him to act like bloody Ikkaku, Yumichka? Who were both willing to lose pillars and thus endanger the lives of innocent humans in Karakura town because they had complexes about uses their full power. Or did you actually find Love acting like a over grown school boy endearing? Kyoraku didn't do anything dishonourable. He treated Starrk with respect and fought him without belittling his strength or poking fun at him for being a hollow. The fact he stabbed him in the back means little. Tinni 23:48, October 12, 2009 (UTC)

Funny thing is that Shunsui is more sneaky than Soifon, the leader of assassins :P Akeki 07:29, October 13, 2009 (UTC)


 * Who said that Kyoraku is more sneaky than Soifon?

However try to talk about the fact for instance. Using whatever is necessary to accomplish a mission implicates to use also the sneaky ones. Everyone said a thing then the next lines write the contrary. For the ones who seems not understand, it is is better to learn the meaning of the terms; anyway, instead of writing Kyoraku is or isn't sneaky, think about the definitions of the word, then I show U the dictionary version:
 * sneaky
 * 1.underhanded, not straight, evasive
 * 2.sneaky - in a quiet, stealthy way, marked by caution and secrecy

One more thing, if Kageoni is not a sneaky or tricky ability, how you could call it? Plus, the ability of KatenKyokotsu is to make children games into reality, as it's been said; children games I used to play at school had quite tricky rules, not you? Whatever, it would be my last post because I got bored.Baronofash 11:03, October 13, 2009 (UTC)